Notes for Mary Polly GREEN


There were many women of this era that were either name Mary Polly, or named
Mary and called by nickname Polly.  It is an interesting phenomenon to find
Polly as a nickname for Mary.  I find this throughout the 1800s in many
different family lines.  Sources differ on whether they represent this Mary as
Mary with Polly as a middle name or Mary with Polly as a nickname.

The actual birth date for Mary and her husband Asa Lovelace are given in a
genealogy by Matt Cornwell.  Their ages in the 1860 census match the birth
dates given by Cornwell.  Asa is 42 and Mary is 41.  In the 1870 census, both
amazingly gain 21 years, with their ages being reported as 63 and 62
respectively!

The census in 1870 was in September, while the 1860 census was in August, so
to account for the 21st year, their birthdays would have to be in August. 
However, only Asa is reported by Cornwell as born in August; Mary was born in
November.)  See listings for the 1860 and 1870 censuses in Notes for asa
Lovelace.
Return to Mary Polly GREEN










































Notes for Mary Sirnorah GREEN


1880 Federal Census, Claiborne Parish, Louisiana, 8 June, Ward 3, District 11,
page 9 (scan 272A), Hse/Fam #65
Green, Israel William  W M 76    Married  Mechanic SC SC SC
Green, Martha Cathrine  W F 34 Wife Married GA SC SC
Green, Mary Senora W F 7 Dau LA SC SC

In 1900 Sirnorah and her husband Charles Albert Gorman are enumerated in
Bossier Parish, Louisiana.

1900 Federal Census, Bossier Parish, Louisiana, 19 June, Alden Bridge, Ward 3,
District 18, page 11B,  Hse #229, Fam #232
Gorman, Charlie Head  W M Aug 1871 28 married 6 years  LA KY KY Unreadable
Rents
Gorman, Nora  Wife W F Mch (Mar) 1873 27 married 6 yrs 3 child/2 living LA SC
GA
Gorman, Disey Dau W F Mch (Mar) 1891  9 LA LA LA At School
Gorman, Willie Son W M July 1899 10mos LA LA LA

Living next door is Nora's mother and her single brother Israel Fred.

1900 Federal Census, Bossier Parish, Louisiana, 19 June, Alden Bridge, Ward 3,
District 18, page 11B,  Hse #230, Fam #233
Green, I F Head  W M Mch (Mar) 1869 31 married 6 years  LA SC GA Blacksmith
Rents
Green, MC  Mother W F Jun 1844 55 Widow 6 yrs 1 child/1 living GA SC SC Keeps
House for Son

1910 Federal Census, Bossier Parish, Louisiana, 30 April, Ward 3, District 19,
page 7B, Hse #156, Fam #159
Gorman, Charley D Head M W 28 Married 15 Years TX TX TX Farmer Rents Can Read
and Write
Gorman, Nora C Wife F W 27 Married 15 Years 4 children/2 living LA GA GA Can
Read and Write
Gorman, Wesley Head M W 8 LA TX LA Cannot Read and Write

The middle initials in 1910 are a puzzle, since we know from family sources
the full names:  Charles Albert Gorman and Mary Sirnorah Green

An entry in the 1920 census appears to be this family.  The child reported
earlier as Willie is Wesley here, as in 1910.  I think we might take this as
an indication of the correct name, and chalk up the 1910 name Willie as an
error.

1920 Federal Census, Bossier Parish, Louisiana, 10 January, District 24, page
4A, Hse/Fam #69
Gorman, Charley  Head Owns M W 49 TX NC GA Farmer
Gorman, Sernora  Wife M W 46 LA SC GA
Gorman, Wesley  Son M W 18 LA TX LA Farm Laborer
Gorman, Dolly  Dau F W 9   LA TX LA

Mary Sirnorah Gorman
Birth May 26, 1873 Louisiana
Death Oct 2, 1946
Mother Martha Catherine McKee Green (1844 - 1914)
Spouse Charles Albert Gorman 1871-1954
Children Dollie Gorman Brooks (1910 - 1972)
Siblings:
John C Greene (1866 - 1948)
Israel F Green (1869 - 1947)
Burial Cottage Grove Cemetery, Benton, Bossier Parish, Louisiana
Created by Pat Sproat Apr 22, 2011
--  Find A Grave Memorial #68779599,
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=68779599
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Notes for Matilda GREEN


1860 Federal Census, Cherokee County, Alabama, 7 June, District 2, PO Centre,
page (scan #54), Hse/Fam #388
M M Israel 33 M Farmer $505 Personal Estate born North Carolina [b abt 1827]
Matilda Israel 33 F born South Carolina [b abt 1827]
William M Israel 12 M born Alabama [b abt 1848]
James Israel 10 M born Alabama [b abt 1850]
John Israel 8 M born Alabama [b abt 1852]
George Israel 6 M born Alabama [b abt 1854]
Martha Israel 4 F born Alabama [b abt 1856]

Matilda GREEN
Birth ABT 1826 in NC or SC
Death 26 FEB 1889 in Pryor's Station, Polk, GA
Buried At Pryor's Station, near Cave Springs, Ga
She was a full blood Cherokee Indian
[her father is also noted as full blood, but no similar note about her mother;
I have not seen the evidence for her mother's Cherokee heritage.]
Father Henry GREEN b ABT 1770 in SC
Mother Alley SAXON b ABT 1787 in NC
Marriage Montraville Marvin ISRAEL b 1826 in Buncombe Co, NC
--  Jess Headley,
http://awtc.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=:2716375&id=I11030

Sources I have seen for Matilda's husband's name spell it Monterville. I have
not been able to adequately document the Cherokee heritage.  It is doubtful
Matilda could have been full blood.

Pryor's station, decribed here as near Cave Springs, is in Polk County,
Georgia.  Cave Springs is in Floyd County, Georgia.  So they lived close to
the county line.
--  Wikipedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cave_Spring,_Georgia

In the 1870 census their address in Floyd County.

1870 Federal Census, Floyd County, Georgia, 10 August, Subdivision 141, PO
Rome, page 83, Hse #596, Fam #583
Isrell, Matilda 43 F W Keeping House $100 Real Estate No Personal  born South
Carolina Cannot write
Isrell, James M 19 M W Works on Farm born Alabama Cannot read or write
--  page 84 --
Isrell, John Wesley 17 M W Works on Farm born Alabama Cannot read or write
Isrell, George W 15 M W Works on Farm born Alabama Cannot read or write
Isrell, Martha E 14 No Occupation F W born Alabama Cannot read or write

Matilda is a lone widow in her home in 1880, living a few houses down from her
son James Monroe.

1880 Federal Census, Polk County, Georgia, 9 June, Hampton Township, District
166, page 19, HseFam #228
Isreal, Matilda W F 52  Keeping House NC NC NC [b abt
1828]
Return to Matilda GREEN










































Notes for Mattie Mable GREEN


Texas Death Certificate
Mable Green
Single White Girl Child
Born 13 February 1926 Duncan [Stephens County], Oklahoma
Died 2 April 1928 Silverton, Briscoe County, Texas
Cause of Death Influenza, contributory cause Rickets
Father Taylor Green, born Hill Co, Texas
Mother Mattie Lovin, born Davis [Murray County], Oklahoma
Informant Taylor Green, Silverton
Burial 3 April 1928 Silverton, by Silverton Undertaking Co
Certificate #125099 filed 30 April 1928

The Strickland Family genealogy has information on Mattie Mabel Green, but
provides no source information.  The genealogy appears to draw on family
information, such as Mabel's first name, Mattie.  The birth date here,
however, differs one year from the date reported on Mabel's death certificate.

The latter says Mabel was born 13 February 1926, while the genealogy has 13
February 1925.  I have found many instances of one-year discrepancies like
this, even where the gravestone being in error.  I will accept the date on the
death certificate, which also reports the place of birth as Duncan, Oklahoma.

Mattie Mabel Green
Birth 13 Feb 1925 in Duncan, Stephens, Oklahoma
Death 2 Apr 1928 in Silverton, Briscoe, Texas
Parents Taylor Green b 1878, Mattie Arletta Lovin 1884-1969
--  Strickland Family,
http://trees.ancestry.com/tree/22944665/person/1368471895?ssrc=&ftm=1
Return to Mattie Mable GREEN










































Notes for Melvin S GREEN


1860 Federal Census, Hall County, Georgia, 2 June, District 570, P O
Gainesville, page 5, Hse #44, Fam #39
T M Green 31 M Farmer $500 Real Estate $500 Personal  born GA [b abt 1829]
Elizabeth Green 35 F born So Carolina [b abt 1825]
W J Green 10 F born GA [b abt 1850]
Robert Green 7 M born GA [b 1853]
-- page 6 --
J E Green 4 F born GA [b abt 1856]
W S Green 1 M born GA [b 1859]

Though the first initial looks like a W, this may be M S Green.  In the 1880
census for this family, a son is reported age 21, which would match this son
of 1 years old here.  His name is Melvin S Green.  This name matches the
initials of one of the executors of Tyree's estate in 1900.  Two of his sons
are named only by initials, R C (Robert C) and M S).

In the 1870 census, the enumerator heard the name as Mevlina, and reported
Melvin as a daughter.

1870 Federal Census, Hall County, Georgia, 13 June, Whelchel's District, PO
Gainesville, page 37-38), Hse #309, Fam #267
Green, Tira [Tyree]  42 M W Farmer $250 Real Estate $400 Personal Estate born
Georgia [b abt 1828]
Green, Elizabeth 48 F W Keeping House born Tennessee Cannot write [b abt 1822]
-- page 38 --
Green, William J 19 M W Laboring on Farm born Georgia [b abt 1851]
Green, Robert 18 M W Laboring on Farm born Georgia [b abt 1852]
Green, Lizzie 13 F W Laboring on Farm born Georgia [b abt 1857]
Green, Melvina [Melvin] 10 F [M] W Laboring on Farm born Georgia [b abt 1860]
Green, Elbert 7 M W Laboring on Farm born Georgia [b 1863]

1880 Federal Census, Hall County, Georgia, 5 June, Whelchels District,
District 139, page 11 (scan 151C), Hse #99, Fam #100
Greene, Tiree  W M 53 Farmer GA SC SC [b abt 1827]
Greene, Elizabeth  W F 55 Wife Keeping House Cannot read or write GA SC SC [b
abt 1825]
Greene, Elizabeth W F 15 [25] Dau Single Works on Farm GA GA GA [b abt 1865]
Greene, Melvin S W M 21 Son Single Works on Farm GA GA GA [b abt 1859]
Greene, Elbert W M 18 Son Single Works on Farm GA GA GA [b abt
1862]
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Notes for Memory Carvus GREEN


We first have a public record of Memory C Green in 1870, when in the census he
is recorded as Buddy.  He is only one month old at census time in Cleveland
County, North Carolina, for the 1870 census.

1870 Federal Census, Cleveland County, North Carolina, 9 September, Township
2, PO Mooresboro, page 6, Hse/Fam #40
Green, Richard C 22 M W Farmer b NC [b abt 1848]
Green, Clementine 22 F b NC [b abt 1848]
Green, Buddy 1 month M W At Home b NC [b Aug 1869]

In 1880, Memory C, or Buddy, is living with his widowed father in his
grandparents' home, along with his younger brother William C Green.

1880 Federal Census, Cleveland County, North Carolina, 9 June, Township 2,
page 13A (scan p 475), Hse #121, Fam #127
Green, William H  W M 57   Farmer NC NC NC [b abt 1822]
Green, Matilda C  W F 52  Wife Keeping House NC NC NC [b abt 1828]
Green, Richard C  W M 32 Son Farm Laborer NC NC NC [b abt 1848]
Green, Memory C  W M 9 Grandson NC NC NC [b abt 1870]
Green, William C  W M 7 Grandson NC NC NC [b abt 1873]

One anonymous genealogy in the Ancestry World Tree collection reports his full
name and date of birth and death, as well as confirming that he was born in
the Boiling Springs location of Cleveland County, North Carolina.

Memory Carvus Green, b 2 Aug 1870 in Boiling Springs (Cleveland County), North
Carolina, d 9 Mar in Gaffney, North Carolina
-- 
http://awtc.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=*v63t0746&id=I027&ftm=1
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Notes for Meral M GREEN


1930 Federal Census, Canadian County, Oklahoma, 30 April, Yukon, District 9-32,
Page 9A, Hse/Fam #195
Davis, Withers C Head Rents Has No Radio  M W 27 First Married at age 21 [abt
1924] TX TX TX Farmer [b abt 1903]
Davis, Merle M Wife F W 21 First Married at age 15 [abt 1924] OK TX TX [b abt
1909]
Davis, Withers Son M W 5 OK TX OK [b abt 1925]

The census reports that they married when Meral was 15 and Withers (Clay) and
Merle was 21.  From their ages, that would be about 1928.  Their son W C Jr
was 5 years old.  Merle died and Withers marreid again in 1936, this time to
Inez Criswell, in Clay County. Texas.
Return to Meral M GREEN










































Notes for Meshack GREEN


There are some sources providing many good details, but citing no sources (not
even family tradition!).  these sources  provide spotty information on
selected individuals in some of the Green lineages.  It seems that several
amateur (or otherwise sloppy) genealogists have confused various lines.  Let
me just encourage everyone to look at the details you are considering from a
common-sense perspective to find obvious errors of age and birth dates.

Judith Chadwell in her genealogy of one Green line, reports the marriage in
Tennessee of a Meshack Green born in 1755 Baltimore to a Susannah Green
(parents Steven Green and Jemima Cook) born in South Carolina.  Some
researchers question the reports that this Meshack Green was born in
Baltimore.  It is quite likely that two or more Green lines have been confused
at various stages by various researchers, including myself.  Some such crossed
lines have been corrected in our database.

Meshack Green, b 1755-12-25 Baltimore, Baltimore, Maryland, d 1510-06-01
Morgan County, Tennessee
Son of Isaac Green 1721-1800 & Rebecca  b 1725
Married Susannah Green (maiden name) b 1762 Greenfield, Aiken, South Carolina
d Unknown date Morgan County, Tennessee [no sources given]
Daughter of Steven Green and Jemima Cook (no info)
Married 1 Jan 1794 in Tennessee
Son Alfred S Green 1803-1883

Meshack Green
b 1755-12-25 Baltimore, Baltimore, Maryland
d 1510-06-01 Morgan County, Tennessee
married Susannah Green (maiden name)
b 1762 Greenfield, Aiken, South Carolina
d Unknown date Morgan County, Tennessee [no sources given]
--  Judith Chadwell, Christopher Family Tree,
http://trees.ancestry.com/pt/person.aspx?pid=-1708233696&tid=1248604&ftm=1

This and other genealogies report that the father of this Meshack Green was
Isaac Green (1721-1800) and Rebecca Green (b 1725).  Both Isaac and Rebecca
died in Baltimore.  The information in Judith's genealogy means that Meshack
moved at some time on his own to Tennessee, where he met Susannah Green, who
had moved (with her parents?) from South Carolina, and they married in
Tennessee.

Several genealogies have made Meshack W Green, born in 1720, the son of Isaac
Green.  This would mean the father was one year old when the son was born! 
WHy the genealogists do not catch this glaring error is a mystery.  Isaac's
wife Rebecca, reported as Meshack W Green's mother, was born in 1725!  Five
years after Meshack W was born !  The Meshack that was the son of Isaac is the
one born in 1755, as indicated in the data above.  It is obviously impossible
for Isaac born 1721 and his wife Rebecca to be the parents of Meshack W Green,
husband of Creasy

The birth of Susannah Green in South Carolina seems to bring into question the
role and identity of Meshack's family line, since we have other Greens in
South Carolina with a Meshack born in Pendleton District SC in 1720.  This
Meshack or one of his brothers could have been the brother of Meshack b 1755,
instead of the Baltimore Isaac.  Maybe Susannah's Meshack was also born in SC
instead of Maryland.

No sources are mentioned by Judith or other genealogies I have seen that seem
otherwise to provide credible information on their families.  Why can't these
people tell us where they got this information?  How can we determine its
reliability or credibility?

At this point, it seems wise to consider the Meshack b 1755 as we have the
information tying him to the Baltimore family, and consider the line of
Meshack b 1720 in Pendleton District, SC as a separate family lineage.  This
will be an area to probe in this continuing search.  It is also likely that
Susannah is a member of the same lineage in South Carolina as the Meshack born
in 1720 in Pendleton.

There are also some suspicious aspects of the information Judith provides
about Meshack (b 1755) and Susannah.  For instance, Meshack is reported as
born in Baltimore, where both his parents were born and died.  So far so good,
but then we find that Meshack and Susannah married in Tennessee, when Meshack
would have been 39!.  When and why did the single Meshack move from Baltimore
to Tennessee.  Was he married before he met Susannah?

Almost everyone going south and west went through Pendleton District, SC.  Did
Meshack perhaps go that way too? If so, isn't it likely he met Susannah in SC? 
Did they maybe marry in SC instead of Tennessee?  Why were they both so old
when they married?  How are their two lines of Greens related?

Did Susannah move from South Carolina to Tennessee with her parents?  As a
child?  As an adult?  She was 32 when she is reported to have married Meshack? 
Was she also perhaps married before?  Only one child is reported?  What is the
configuration of Meshack and Susannah's family?  Why are these questions not
dealt with?

Researcher Malissa Ruffner sent me information on a land transfer record that
might give us a reference date for Meshack's move away form Baltimore.  this
deed was transferred to his brother Abednego in June 1805, perhaps in
preparation for his move to the south.  This indicates his wife was named
Mary.  It seems likely that Mary moved with him to the Carolinas.  Since
Susannah is reported born in South Carolina, it seems likely that Meshack met
and married her there after Mary's death, before moving on to Tennessee.

"I'm working on the Green family for a friend of mine and I've been spending a
lot time on the Shadrack-Meshack-Abednego trio of brothers.  One of the things
I picked up from a surname file here in town (and by that, I mean Baltimore) 
is a citation to a land record of 1805.  Here's the description.
"8 June 1805 - Meshack Green of Balto. Co. deeds to Abednego Green 1/3 the
land willed to him by his father Isaac Green.  Meshack's wife Mary consented
to the sale. (Baltimore Co. Land Records, W. G. #87, fol. 100.)"
--  Malissa Ruffner, email to Orville Boyd Jenkins, 02 July 2012

Thanks to Malissa for this helpful record is helpful.  This would be the
Meshack Green who was the born the son if Isaac and Rebecca in 1755, and a
brother of Abednego.  I have not been able to confirm the siblings, nor
parents of Meshack W Green, who is fairly obviously related to the
Gardner-Green Cherokee line.  The exact connection is still being sought on
several fronts, but confirming links are elusive.  We are careful.  There are
too many thrown-together, unanalyzed and self-contradictory lists out there.

If this Meshack brother of Abednego and son of Isaac in Baltimore, was still
in Baltimore with his wife named Mary in 1805, it is not likely this is the
same Meshack that was married to Susannah in South Carolina in 1794.  So
several Meshacks and Shadracks have been confused in various genealogies.  And
I have been assisted to untangle some of those erroneous cross-connections in
this database.  Insufficient facts are available in many cases.  It is a
success to recognize that and let it stand till needed detail is discovered.

Where no confirming data is available, or where obviously incompatible dates,
like the birth dates of Isaac in 1721 and Meshack in 1720, we have to leave
the question open, and resist connecting two lines that don't go together,
just to resolve the question.  Meshack Greens just happened to be for some
reason a very popular name in several green lines.  There may be a connection
somewhere but it is definitely not with Meshack W Green as the son of Isaac
and Rebecca in Baltimore.

Some bits of progress are made periodically, and there may thus be
inconsistencies in the presentation and analysis of the related information on
the various individuals involved.

1830 Federal Census, Morgan County, Tennessee, Eastern District, page 96
Meshack Green  1 male 5-10 yrs, 1 male 30-40, 1 male 60-70
1 female under 5, 1 female 15-20, 1 female 20-30, 1 female 50-60

In 1830 there are two other younger Greens living near Meshack.  John lives
next door, and James is recorded two houses above him on the same page.

1830 Federal Census, Morgan County, Tennessee, Eastern District, page 96
John Green  1 male under 5 yrs, 1 male 5-10, 1 male 30-40
1 female 10-15,  1 female 20-30

1830 Federal Census, Morgan County, Tennessee, Eastern District, page 96
James Green  1 male under 5 yrs, 1 male 20-30, 1 female 15-20

1840 Federal Census, Morgan County, Tennessee, Eastern District, page 208
Pensioner for Revolutionary War  Meshac Green 1 male 80-90, 1 female 70-80
Meshac Green age 87 [b abt
1753]
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Notes for Meshack W GREEN


U.S. and International Marriage Records, 1560-1900
Meshack Green
Birth 1717 NC
Spouse Name Creasy
Marriage State of SC

One or more genealogies have Isaac Green as the father of Meshack W Green. 
But the dates for Isaac Green do not match with the Meshack W Green
information I have.  The Meshack born in 1720 could not be the son of this
Isaac, son of John Green & Mary Sampson, who was born in 1721, as some
genealogies have.

There are further several individuals of the name Meshack Green or some
similar spelling, with few details to confirm family relationships.  The name
Meshack was very popular around that time, along with Shadrack and Abednego.

Uncertainties
I have not become fully comfortable with the relationships or fully confident
about the family of similar Greens our Meshack goes with.  But we have
confirmed that both Meshack and his wife Lucretia Franklin were fullblood
Cherokee.  There seems to be a connection to the Gardner Green line of
Cherokees, but records are hard to come by to substantiate this. 
Circumstantial evidence is strong and is affirmed by several who have probed
this matter deeply, many of whom I have worked with.

The line from Meshack down seems firm.  Different genealogies, of varying
degrees of credibility, have various fathers for this Meshack.  Suggested
names for Meshack W Green's father are Isaac, William and Meshack.  There are
dating problems and generational time problems in some of these.  Troy Sims
proposes, with uncetainty, that the parents of Meshack W Green are John and
Nancy (maiden name unknown) Green.

In September 2019 I made some updates to my tree to include what seem to be
the most solid relationships, as proposed by our cadre of Meshack and Gardner
Green researchers.  Some of these are uncertain, but may serve as a more solid
basis for confirming or invalidating research.

There are several Meshack Greens, and there are some indications they are kin
in various ways.  Individual details are spotty.  There were some indications
that the 1810 census Meshack is a son or nephew of our Meshack and Lucretia.

New work in 2015 on Meshack's children and their descendants indicated that is
unlikely.  I have worked with several descendants on the factors of the
Meshack Green and related families, and there are many holes we have not yet
entirely plugged.

Cherokee
In December 2007, working with another Green family researcher, I found
references to Meshack and his wife Lucretia (Creasy) Franklin.  The research
site discusses the claims by both this Green line and the Franklin family to
Cherokee heritage.  DNA findings also connect this Green family to the Greens
in Madison, Illinois, who at one time presented their research online.
(Unfortunately, this website dropped off the Internet at some point, and I
have not found it on any alternative domain.)

Various family researchers present indications and testimonies to Meshack
and/or Lucretia's Cherokee origins.

"I have my great grandmother's supplemental application.  Her name was Fannie
Bryant Bruce.  Her father was Hardy Bryant.  Hardy's mom was Fannie Green,
daughter of Daniel Green & Mary Green.  There was the name Mashack in the old
Green Bible, said William Bryant, brother of Hardy Bryant.  They were rejected
on their Cherokee blood, but I know they were Cherokee.  Fannie Green was born
in 1808, had a brother Isaac 1801, John 1804, Thomas 1806, Fannie 1808, Daniel
1810, Elizabeth 1812, Andrew Jackson 1815, Toliver 1817, Enoch 1820, Isona
1823."
--  Gary Cruce, message on profile for Mary Green, wife of Daniel John Green,
on OurFamily genealogy, 10 July 2015,
http://www.ourfamtree.org/browse.php?pid=60396

I have not seen any actual pages from the Green Family Bible, to which I have
seen references like this one from Gary Cruce.

Some discussion about the Gardner Green lineage is found on Ancestry.com
Discussion lists.  I am not sure if these are publicly available to
non-subscribers from links I provide below. It seems quite likely that Meshack
belongs to this line of Greens.

That source also reports that Meshack Green lived in the Old 96th District of
South Carolina, part of which later went into Pendleton District when it was
established in 1789, mostly out of former Cherokee lands.  This is consistent
with the information on Meshack compiled by Glenda Pool, reporting Meshack
born about 1720 in Pendleton District, South Carolina.  96th District was
formed in 1769, then partitioned into smaller areas.  The 96th District name
was discontinued in 1798.

Gardner Green family information reports vaguely that the Franklins claim
their Cherokee descent from Gardner Green.  This is not clear as to whether it
means due to Lucretia's marriage to Meshack, or if the Franklins were
previously already kin to these Greens.  Details are spotty.

There is considerable information on this Gardner Green Cherokee family in
discussion lists on Ancestry.com.
--  Gardner Cherokee Green, "Gardner Green, Cherokee 1735-1835,"
http://boards.ancestry.com/surnames.green/12.144/mb.ashx

"Records to this point show that we [this Green family line] most likely came
from the Isle of Wight in the early 18th century. Our family migrated into
Lunenburg/Halifax/Mecklenberg VA and moved to NC around the mid-eighteenth
century.  Then on to Kentucky and the Old 96th District by around 1780's.  We
know from DNA studies that we are on the right track with Frederick Green of
Lunenburg VA and Meshack Green of Old 96th District that married Lucretia
(Creasy) Franklin.  Our family's testimony on their Cherokee applications
support these DNA findings that we are related to the Franklins; this is also
backed up Gardner Green's location to Esom/Isom Franklin in Greenville SC land
plats."
--  Troy Sims, Gardner-Green Family website, no longer online

"Meshack Green is more likely a brother or uncle to Gardiner Green, born 1735
VA.  Our Dream DNA Links Meshach and Gardner Green.  Also the family coming
out of Lunenburg, Virginia, Edward Ware, Henry Ware, William Sizemore, Isom
Franklin.  Our family is likely Nottoway Indian that merged with the Cherokee
Indian tribe when pushed off their lands. Just speculation at this point. 
Although I do find a connection to the doublehead family via and my 4th great
grandfather Lewis Green. Cheers."
--  Troy Sims, Comment on this genealogy in RootsWeb, 29 August 2017

"Isom Franklin is living in Greenville SC in the late 1700's. His land is well
into Cherokee territory, and is associated with Henry Sizemore, Meschack
Green, Gardner Green, Thomas Franklin, and Ephraim Franklin. I believe Isom's
daughter to be Lucretia Franklin that married Meshack Green."  (Troy Sims is a
genealogical researcher on the Green familiy line among the various Native
American tribes of Virginia and the Caroinas, and a descendant of Gardner
Green, related tio Meshack W Green and Lucretia Franklin of Pendleton
District, South Carolina.)
--  Troy Sims, Ancestry Discussion Group, 22 September 2011

P J Martin shares helpful family information that reports that her ancestor
John Green is thought to be the son of Meshack W Green and Lucretia Franklin.

"I am a descendant of Lucressa and Adam Campbell.  Cressa is what some call
her.  Her father was John Green from the Carolina's. She was of Native
heritage, but I am not sure how much.  Adam and Lucressa settled in Jasper,
Alabama and owned land near Smith Lake. This was before the Civil War.  They
had at least two sons who fought for the Union Army.  They both died of
sickness during the war.  Adam and Lucressa were common law husband and wife
because she was considered a woman of color by law, due to her Native
heritage.  I understand that John Green's father was a Meshach, but have no
evidence.  Lucressa and Adam are both buried near Smith Lake."
--  P J Martin, email to Orville Boyd Jenkins, 12 May  2014

"Fullblood"

Among the various family sources, there are reports of Cherokee descent for
either one, or for both Meshack and Lucretia.  Some say "part or full blood." 
Due to the confusion in claims in the various sources, it seemed unlikely that
either one was full blood Cherokee.  But again, as I say, details are unclear,
and reports are spotty and not fully consistent.

This term "fullblood" also is tricky and misleading in usage, or at best
ambiguous. What does the speaker/writer actually have in mind and imply by
this arcane term?  it is not a scientific term.  Blood itself does not
actually indicate ethnic heritage.

We are all mixed with all kinds of human DNA.  Virginia and other Eastern
Native Americans bean intermarrying with European immigrants very early on. 
It appears often what unsophisticated writers mean by "fullblood" is in the
social culture and clan structure of the Cherokee or Pamunkey people.  Social
and ethnic identification are not the same thing as DNA origins.  The use of
the traditional ancient metaphor "blood" for heritage is also misleading when
people nowadays tend to conclude this means in a "pure" stream of ethnic
ancestry and DNA strain.

A DNA report of a Green group where at least one of them had reported our
Meshack W Green as an ancestor seems to prove definitively that Meshack could
not be "fullblood" Cherokee, in the popular aand common sense of that word,
since his paternal Y-DNA indicates a European genetic haplogroup.

His mother could have been part or fullblood Cherokee.  As we and other
resesarchers have pointed out, from very early in European settlement,
Cherokees and Euroepans intermarried.  Many individuals, especially European
men marrired to Cherokee women became part of the Cherokee ancestral lineage.

Additionally, Cherokees seem to have genetic connections with some Caribbean
Native Americans who also had very early input of European genes that may have
entered the Cherokee stream.  So what do they mean by "fullblood" Cherokee? 
This may be a simplistic use of this terminology.

"According to family history that I have, Gardner Green and Rachel Foalsom
registered with the Cherokee Nation as full blooded in 1835, which may have
been on the Henderson Roll in Fannin County, "Rocky Creek," Georgia.  They
then moved to Randolf County, Missouri (town of Macon) and had children."
--  Rellen King, Ancestry Discussion Group, 27 September 2010

--------------------
There were over 200 applications filed from the Green family that Gardner
Green was Native American.  These families lived all over the US and could
hardly have had very close ties with each other since generations had gone by
and separated even more from migrating west.

My grandmother Lillian Golden Green is descended from Gardner Green and told
me that we were Cherokee and Sapponi Indian through the Green family.  It's a
very hard thing to trace, but I suspect the Native American possibly goes back
to the Nansemond tribes of VA, and then merged with the Cherokee in the late
18th century.  The Vann's fighting under Lieutenant Gardner Green when they
took Orangeburg from the rebels where Cherokee.

The Gardner Green on the 1835 MS Rolls may have been this Gardner Green's son. 
He married Sally Childress in Cumberland Ky in the late 1700's.
--  Troy Sims, Ancestry Discussion Group, 22 September 2011
--------------------

DNA
Troy Sims reported a connection known to him from his side of the family.  He
had extensively researched his Green line and their relationship to the
Sizemores and Sullivans.  These are names that show up in the information and
records for Meshack W Green.  See related comments below by Barbara Cook on
the relationship to these various families.

"Thanks for your notes. Off the top of my head, this Meshack Green line is
connected to the Greens of Rutherford NC, and Henry Green that died around
1745 Lunenburg Va.  This is confirmed through DNA testing."
--  Troy Sims, Comment on this genealogy in RootsWeb, 25 September 2011

Sims reports that some DNA tests have been done, and that these indicate
Native American origins for Meshack's descendants.

"I was the first one to do a Green DNA research study on this family line. 
Initially we had 0 matches.  Now I lost count, over 40 maybe. ... I spent many
hours in the Sutro library in San Francisco digging up whatever I could.  And
also many hours online. ... So my final thoughts on the matter were the
government did not want them to obtain enrollment but rather be assimilated
into white society.  That was the government's job.  Eliminate the Indians and
take their resources.  There were some other political reasons amongst the
tribes to allow this to happen."
--  Troy Sims, Comment on this genealogy in RootsWeb, 25 September 2011

Lynne Burgess is another researcher with whom we have had considerable
exchange on the identity of Meshack, his line and the indications from DNA.

"I was going back through my results and realized one of closer matches by the
name of Sullivan (from Tenn) shares Meshack as a common ancestor. The
confidence level is 'very high' for the match."
--  Lynne F Burgess, Ancestry messaging to Orville Boyd Jenkins, 17 September 
2015

Another Green line in my genealogy is related in several ways by marriage to
my wife's paternal line of McSwains, and the related Padgetts, Bridges,
Hamricks and others in Cleveland and Rutherford Counties in North Carolina and
neighboring areas of South Carolina.  This would seem to be the line of Greens
that Troy Sims referred to in his earlier comments.

In studying Y-DNA reports, I found that a member of this family group, David
Howell Green, is reported in the same Y-DNA group as Meshack W Green.  This is
based, it seems. on reported ancestors of individuals who have had their DNA
tested.  Thus the strength of any DNA relationship in these DNA comparison
reports is no stronger than the validity and credibility of the ancestral
claim itself.  I have reconstructed David's ancestor tree back to one Joseph
Green (1725-1771).

David Howell Green (1824-1863)  is reported in Family Tree DNA in the same
Y-DNA12 marker group as Meshack W Green (1720-1799).  These are listed in the
Family Tree Green-Greene DNA Project under R1b1a2a1a1b3c, as relatives of
Thomas F and Winifred (Seybourne) Green, St Marys, Maryland.
--  Green/Greene, Family Tree DNA,
https://www.familytreedna.com/public/Green/default.aspx?section=ycolorized

The parents of Joseph Green have not been confirmed.  The parents of Meshack W
Green, likewise, have not been fully confirmed.  Thus their connection to
Thomas F Green is not certain.  However, Troy Sims' determination for
Meshack's father as John Green is what we are presenting now.

Another member of this kinship group, named Thomas Norton Green, born about
1500, shares the R-L2 haplogroup of DNA with Meshack W Green  in this same
Y-DNA12 kinship group.  These two are the only ones of this haplogroup who are
reported in this list of relatives of Thomas F and Winifred (Seybourne) Green. 
David Howell Green has a different haplogroup, R-M269.

One thing this tells us is, if this genetic relationship indeed is correct for
Meshack W Green, he could not possibly be fullblood Cherokee.  Mitochondrial
DNA analysis could tell us the other side of the picture.  So far that
analysis and any connection for Meshack has not been conclusive.

Here is a brief description from FamilyTree DNA of the family group and
specific Haplogroup L2 for Meshack.

"R1b is a haplogroup or branch of the human family tree of paternal lineages.
It is marked by a mutation of the Y chromosome named M343.  P25 and M269 are
part of R1b along with several large younger subclades; L21, U152, DF27, P312,
U106 & Z2103."
--  Family Tree DNA, cited in
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/R1b-YDNA/info

For more detail see:
R1b-L21 Descendants Tree Chart,
https://www.familytreedna.com/groups/r-l21/about/background

Early Records
A Green enumerated as Masheek Green is reported in Pendleton District, South
Carolina, the right location for our Meshack.  Rutherford was the neighboring
county in North Carolina.  I have not yet been able, however, to verify
Meshack's connection to the Green line most plentiful there, related to Henry
and Isaac, based on records.

The Rutherford line of Greens were very prominent in other lines there like
the McSwains, Padgetts, Hamricks and other intermarried clans of Rutherford. 
These are covered in some detail in this genealogy.  This line is found in
North and South Carolina and in points west as they migrated out.  Meshack's
descendants moved out, too, to settle in Alabama, Arkansas, Louisiana, Texas
and Oklahoma, the on westward in the 1900s.

1790 South Carolina Census, Pendleton District, page 14
Masheek Green head of household
3 Free White Males Under 16
2 Free White Males 16 and Over
4 Free White Females
No Slaves

Records report what appears to be this Meshack Green in connection with others
originally from Virginia, in land transactions in Pendleton, South Carolina at
this time.  Meshack is connected to Gardner Green and the Sizemore family who
moved from Virginia to South Carolina, and were of Cherokee descent.  The
report of Cherokee descent is strong in various Green genealogies, some of
which are no longer posted.  These genealogies mention the Franklins of
Meshack's wife Lucretia.

Green-Horton descendant Sheri Horton, who was registered as a member of the
Missouri Cherokee tribe, found some information on Meshack's line in Cherokee
Records compiled by Bob Blankenship.  She has a copy from another publication
by Jack D Baker.  Sheri found an ancestor in Meshack's family, as a son-in-law
mentioned in Meshack's will, named John Horton.

"I found my great grandfather x4 in the 1817 Cherokee emigration rolls.  He is
also listed on Meshack's will as his son-in-law, as is Isaac Horton who
married Meshack' s daughter Mary. The 1817 emigration roll says that those
undersigned agree to give up (loose translation in my words) their land in
Cherokee territory for land in the Arkansas territory.  Those records are
transcribed in a book titled Cherokee Roots vol 1 by Bob Blankenship."
--  Sheri Horton, personal Ancestry Messaging to Orville Boyd Jenkins, 26
August 2015

The ancestor she is talking about would be John (Brissell) Horton, who married
Meshack's daughter Nancy Anne.  Nancy Ann was born before Meshack married
Lucretia Franklin.  No name is know for a previous wife of Meshack.  Nancy Ann
was about the same age as Lucretia Franklin.

The book by Blankenship is available from several sources, but ranges in price
from $10 to $100.  The book is described on GoodReads as "Official United
States Government Census of the Cherokee Indian from 1817 through 1924
residing East of the Mississippi River."
--  GoodReads,
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2163608.Cherokee_Roots_Volume_1

--------------------
Meshack W Greene
Born about 1716 in Dinwiddie, Virginia

Son of John Green [uncertain] and Elizabeth (Unknown) Green [uncertain]
Brother of Henry Green, John Green Jr, Mary (Green) Griffin, Shadrack Green
and Abednego Green

Husband of Ann (Unknown) Green - married 1736 in VA map
Husband of Mary (Unknown) Green - married 1746 in Pendleton, SC map
Husband of Lucretia (Franklin) Green - married about 1749 in SC map
--  Troy Sims, Email to Orville Boyd Jenkins, 18 September 2019
--------------------

1790: Pendleton District, SC Deeds 1790-1806
22 Jul. 1790
Thomas Coker of Abbeville Co., S.C. to John Green of Greenville Co., S.C., for
£10
50 Acres on Hurricane Creek, South side of Saluda River, part of tract granted
to Thomas Coker, whereon he now lives.
Recorded Bk. YYYY, p. 408, 22 Jan. 1789, bd. Crawfish Branch, John Johnston.
Wit:
Meshack Green
Lewis Green
James Sizemore
Lewis Green made oath 22 Jul. 1790
--  originally on the Gardner Green genealogy website, no longer online

Another researcher, Barbara Cook, has shared with me some of her findings,
from research on the Franklin side of this lineage.  She has found similar
names and relationships.  The James Sizemore mentioned here is likely the same
James Sizemore who was a witness in the deed transaction we have just
examined.

"You do know Gardner Green owned land next to Isshom [Isham or Issom]
Franklin, found on the Internet one time but can't find it now. Did I tell you
on my kin's Guion Miller application, she listed my Thomas Franklin born
around 1780 as dark complected, coarse black hair.  She is the only one that
had seen Thomas Jefferson Franklin.  I believe Ephriam [sic] Franklin and
Nancy were his parents.  I have Ephriam Franklin's estate papers, and he names
Thomas Bartley Henry and James Sizemore as heirs.  James was married to
Patience Franklin."
--  Barbara Cook, email to Orville Boyd Jenkins, 4 February 2012

Barbara Cook also contributed the transcription of a deed she had in which
Meshack was a witness, which also involved a Sizemore.

"I have a deed from James Johnson to a Thomas Franklin.  I am sure it is not
Thomas Jefferson Franklin; it is in 1771.  It has H Sizemore as witness, and
Meshack Green.  I have seen the posting many times of Lucretia Franklin
marrying Meshack Green, and since Lucretia is also in my line, I figure it is
the same bunch, so who is H Sizemore?"
--  Barbara Cook, email to Orville Boyd Jenkins, January 30, 2012

1769/22/Feb. SC Deed Abstracts Vol.IV p.189- Book V3 pp.367-372 L&R
James JOHNSTON to THOMAS FRANKLIN both of Granville Co., SC.
(Receipt says paid by Solomon WOOD) 100A on the CHEROKEE PONDS in Granville
Co. granted 1 Feb. 1768 to James JOHNSTON surveyed on "warrant of William
COCHRAM," bounding on all sides on vacant land.
Witnesses:
ISSUM FRANKLIN
MESHACK GRIM [GREEN JK]
HENRY SIZEMORE
Before Lewis POWELL, J.P. on 3 Mar. 1769.  Rec. 14 Aug. 1771

The Sizemore lineage has done a DNA sampling test that went fairly deep into
comparison with other lineages showing the same unique Native American marker. 
This Indian Y-chromosome gene came from the Caribbean, predating English
colonies in Virginia.  They became associated with the Cherokee in the
colonies later.  You can read more about the Sizemore Native American genetics
here:
--  Sizemore DNA, http://www.sizemorednaproject.com/history_surname.html

Two different collections of genealogies in Ancestry's Trees have some bits of
information, some more helpful than others, as usual in the hodge-podge.  None
suggest parents for either Meshack or Lucretia (Creasy or "Creory," probably a
misreading of the cursive for Creasy).  The nickname Cready for Lucretia also
occurs in other family lines in this historical period.
--  Lucretia Franklin, http://trees.ancestry.com/owt/person.aspx?pid=26541410
--  Meshack Greene, http://trees.ancestry.com/owt/person.aspx?pid=41510326

Confusion
Jess Headley presents the following information and family structure for
Meshack and Lucretia.

Meshack GREEN, Birth 1720, Death 1799 in Pendleton Dist, S.C.
Burial AFT 1850 Gwinnett Co, Ga [51 years after death!]
Marriage Lucretia FRANKLIN b: ABT 1755 [when he was 35 years old]
Children:
Nancy Anne GREEN
Mary Ann GREEN b: 1767
Henry GREEN b: ABT 1770 in SC
Elizabeth GREEN b: 1774
Thomas GREEN b: 1775
Daniel GREEN b: 1781
John GREEN b: 1784
Francy GREEN b: 1790
--  Jess Headley, onilne link no longer valid

This burial of Meshack in Gwinnett County, Georgia, seems odd, since his death
occurred in Pendleton District, South Carolina.  But look again, this is not
only odd, but impossible!  Meshack's family did not wait around 50 years to
bury Meshack after 1850, when he died in 1799!  That was 130 years after his
birth!  (Don't people ever check their work!?)  So this one entry might call
the whole set of information into question.  Fortunately, other sources
confirm some details of this family.

There are other obvious errors here, as in the first three or four children. 
If Lucretia was born in 1755, she did not have Mary Ann Green in 1767, at age
12!  Other sources have Lucretia born in 1750, but Mary Ann's census record in
Gwinnett County in 1850 says she was 88, making her born in 1762, when
Lucretia was only 12 years old if born in 1750!  And she did not have Nancy
Ann even earlier, or even Henry in 1770, at age 15.  We are approaching
reality with the birth of daughter Elizabeth in 1774.  Besides this, In 1770,
Meshack would have been 50.  It is not likely he married a teenager.  So let's
laugh at this and keep on probing.  Probing still continues in 2015.

Let me here encourage everyone to look at the details you are considering from
a common-sense perspective to find obvious errors of age and birth dates.

Along those lines, even the scenario I have narrowed it down to for Meshack W
Green presents a couple of problems we have not been able to resolve.  The
info we have on children shows Meshack and Lucretia having children at the
point where Meshack is already about 50 years old.  That is very late to marry
for the first time.

It is possible there was a Meshack who had a son named Meshack who married
Lucretia.  But probe as we might, so far no further details or clues have
popped up in any of the clever researching we have all done.

World Family Tree Pedigree #3163
gives name as Meshanks and death date of 1799
--  Henry Greene family, citing will; date is actually probate date of will,
so death would have been a few days earlier

The will (see below) gives place of birth for this Meshack as Pendleton
District, South Carolina.  This does not match the reports (in most
genealogies) that the siblings born after him are reported to be born in
Baltimore!  It appears he was just wedged in to make him fit in this family
where he did not really belong.  So the Baltimore group is probably a
different line or there are generations missing.

Generations
Because of the difference in birth place, Meshack and Abednego may be
misplaced with this family.  Sources are confusing, and the compilers of most
genealogies are not careful, and various information is just flung together. 
There were impossibly long gaps in the information from earlier sources, and
many details that could not fit as the one family represented in those 2 or 3
genealogies.  But there are still uncertainties as I have constructed the
families now.

Glenda Pool's database of what she reconstructed as our family line (received
through family channels, not published) includes a listing of residence for a
Meshack Green in 1810 in Rutherford County, North Carolina.  This, of course,
could not be this Meshack.  But maybe it is his son.  Glenda collected a lot
of information but had not sorted and analyzed it.

Names varied considerably in spelling in this era.  Meshack's name is spelled
in various sources: Meschack, Mischack, Mishach.  The marriage records in the
Yates Collection spells the name Meshanks.  His wife there is stated as Creory
(perhaps Creasy).  This spelling for the wife's name is also in his will.

Carolina
Ancestry.com has the following marriage report on Meshack and Creasy
(Lucretia).  Note that this also reports his birthplace as North Carolina
rather than South Carolina.

U.S. and International Marriage Records, 1560-1900
Meshack Green, Gender male
Birth 17?? NC
Spouse Name Creasy ???
Marriage State SC

In May 2014, I got a note from Sheri Horton, a research colleague working on
our Green family line.  She reported she had succeeded in finding a reference
to Meshack and Lucretia as the ancestors of reference in the line of their
daughter Nancy Ann Green Horton in the Missouri Cherokee Nation.

"I just got my card from the Northern Cherokee Nation for proving John Horton,
wife Nancy Anne Green daughter of Meshack Green(e).  I found therm on the
Emigration rolls of 1817-1835 That Meshack, Creasy, and Nancy Anne were full
Cherokee! [The rolls themselves do not state this;  I have not seen
documentation to this effect.  And our DNA information above makes this
impossible.] ... They are recognised by the state of Missouri and are working
on Federal recognition."
--  Sheri Horton, Ancestry Message to Orville Boyd Jenkins, 10 May 2014

(See my notes earlier on the usage and meaning of "fullblood.")

This information does not mean that Meshack and Nancy Ann's mother were
fullblood Cherokee.  Cherokees had been marrying whites since very early in
the colonial settlement process.  Cherokees accepted the white settlers and
tended to adopt English names.  It seems a high percentage of the Cherokees
intermarried.

Some maintained tribal connections while others moved into the general "white"
stream, which actually included a lot of intermarriage with most native tribes
along the way.  There wasn't the later "racial" dichotomy we see in the rabid
anti-Indian policies of Andrew Jackson.

And if the designation of Meshack as an ancestor is correct in the DNA reports
analyzed, he had to have a European ancestor, as explained in our analysis
above.

Sheri had earlier mentioned the Horton line.

"Regarding Meshack Greene m Creasy (Franklin ?),  Daughter Nancy Anne Greene
married Jonathan Horton, son of Abraham and Martha Brissels Horton. Jonathan
of Quaker faith was excommunicated from the church for marrying out of the
faith, leading me to believe that my gggggrandmother Nancy Anne Greene was of
Cherokee descent.  Jonathan and Nancy's son John married Susan Grider and the
family moved to Washington Co Mo.  John a soldier in the War of 1812, had a
land grant.  The family remains in Washington and surrounding counties."
--  Sheri Horton, email to Orville Boyd Jenkins, 19 October 2010

I think the identity of Jonathan Horton with John (Brissell) Horton is
uncertain, due to some discrepancies in facts and details.  Genealogies do
report the same parents of Jonathan and John.  (There is some uncertainty
about the name Brissell.)  And it is not clear these are alternative names for
the same individual.  Two persons may be conflated in some of these
genealogies.

Several genealogies do report a daughter of Meshack named Nancy Anne, but
report her birth around 1758, about the same time as Lucretia Franklin, who
later married Meshack.  This is the Nancy Ann Green that would be of an age to
have married John (Brissell) Horton.  This is the birth date usually reported
for John Brissell Horton's wife Nancy Ann(e) Green(e).  This would require an
earlier first wife of Mesahck.  And given the date of his birth, he likely was
married long before he would have met and been able to marry Creasy, born
about 1775, according to most sources.  No name or details for any earlier
wife is found anywhere, nor names of any earlier children, other than this
Nancy Ann, born about 1758.

One or more genealogies report a daughter of Lucretia and Meshack named Nancy
Anne Green who was born in 1792.  But this would be too late to be the wife of
John (Brissell) Horton, who was born in 1748.  The place of death in Missouri
matches the reports of Nancy Ann Green Horton, wife of John (Brissell) Horton. 
But maybe her husband John Horton was not John Brissell Horton, but his son or
another younger member of the same family.

The following genealogy reports no husband for the Nancy Anne reported as the
daughter of Meshack and Creasy Green of Georgia.  Two other similar ones
likewise have the later birth date but no husband for Nancy Anne.

Nancy Anne Green
Birth 1792 in Pendleton, Anderson, South Carolina
Death 1850 in Washington, Missouri
Parents:
Meshack W Green 1720 - 1799
Lucretia Creasy Franklin 1725 - 1800
--  Johnson Family Tree,
http://trees.ancestry.com/tree/25805264/person/12451365083

Branches
The family name is often spelled Greene, and is found that way in some current
genealogies.  These spellings are found in free variation back into the
meedieval period Branches of the same family are found in both Carolinas,
Georgia, Tennessee, Virginia, Kentucky, and western states.  The specific line
I am following flows from South Carolina, Georgia, Arkansas and Texas, then
Oklahoma.  There are individuals in North Carolina also who may be part of
this same line.

There are still branches in all these states, and various ones of us are
making connections.  I am not attempting to connect all the many branches and
individuals, but my priority is the family line that wound up in Oklahoma, and
is intertwined with the lines of Mullinax, Mullins and West along the way.

In the earliest information I received, the name of Meshack's father was
William, with sources reporting William's father as either William or Thomas. 
From this source I had the birth of Meshack in 1720.  This early birth date
could not be substantiated or meshed with other facts.  This is the only
source that has a person named William.  Other sources for persons named
Meshack Green or Greene have the name Thomas for his father, or lack a father.

Possibilities
I have found a William Green, whose father is William Green, and who was born
in 1702, in Trenton, Hunterdon County, New Jersey.  But there are no names
like Shadrack, Meshack, Abednego or Thomas associated with this family.  These
names appear only as sons of Isaac as I show here.

This William had a son named William, but he was born in 1743, too late to be
the father of a Meshack Green born in 1755.  These are only the most basic of
the matching problems I have found with these names.

Names
Sources report three children of Meshack with the name John:  John, Daniel
John and John Henry.  Dates vary so wildly that they are not much help, even
in the sources that give separate birth dates for each of the three "Johns." 
Another suspicious fact, two girls also have the middle name Ann:  Nancy Anne
and Mary Ann.

Meshack's will also has the name Joney (or Joncy) of what appears to be a son,
but I can find no other information on a person with such a name.  This could
be Johnny, but there is also a son named John in the will.  It could be Joany,
but the name is in the list of the sons.  Perhaps it was meant to be Jonsy,
but that seems unlikely in light of general naming patterns of that era.

On the other hand, we do see many families in the 1600s-1800s that DO give
multiple children the same name, sometimes as a primary name with a different
middle name, and sometimes with a different first name and the same second
name.  The latter pattern is especially true in the he passing on of maternal
family names.

Dates
I have a problem with the dates given in sources.  Meshack is said to be born
in 1720.  The first child we know of, Henry Green, has a birth date of 1770. 
This is highly unlikely, if not impossible.  This makes his father 50 years
old at his birth -- the birth of the first child!

It is reported that Meshack was married twice.  But all the known children,
except the first, Nancy Ann, fit the time period after the marriage to
Lucretia Franklin, which would be the second marriage This is rather late,
even for a second marriage.  His marriage to Lucretia (Creasy) Franklin was in
1770, according to sources.  He would be age 50 at this marriage, then have
all his children from then through the next 20 years, 30 years by some dates.

Twenty years, maybe; thirty years, not likely.  There is likely a generation
missing somehow, but no data has been found to help clear up this mystery.

It was October 2010 before I got a solid lead on the first wife and links to
other Greens in North and South Carolina.  A Shoemaker genealogy reported a
John Green married to a Charlotte, which I have in this lineage.  John is a
son of Meshack, and I had no maiden name for his wife Charlotte.  The
Shoemaker tree reported her as a Green, with parents I had in this database,
connected to the McSwain-Moore line of Greens.  They are in this genealogy
because of their son Henry, whose son John Elias married Judith Moore McSwain. 
This line is unconnected to the Cherokee Greens.

Further, the Shoemaker data had the parents of John, with a second wife of
Meshack as his mother.  She was named as Mary Polly Wiseman.  Though this
genealogy suffers some of the confusions mentioned above related to Lucretia's
children (and apparently did not know that Creasy was Lucretia), there are
some credible features.

Uh, Oh
There is one big problem here, though.  The wife named in Meshack's will in
1800 is Lucretia!  So this marriage to Mary Polly Wiseman, born in 1860, does
not seem possible.  There may still be two similar lines mixed here.  This is
a forensic process, not a delivered fiat.

It seems to me that there has to be another generation in here.  This would
account for the 50-year spread.  It seems likely that Meshack W had a son,
perhaps named Meshack also, who is the father of the children we know of, who
are reported as born from 1770 on.  Two of the children supposed to be Meshack
W's were even born after Meshack W's death, yet the source makes absolutely no
comment about this and other obvious anomalies about this family.

I have not yet fully worked that out, so there are inconsistencies and gaps in
my data.  A Meshack Green was born on Christmas day in 1755, but he was born
in Baltimore, Maryland.  The names of the different Green(e) families are
uncannily similar, in very disparate locations!  It would not seem likely that
the Meshack born in Baltimore was a son of our Meshack W in South Carolina,
whose descendants later moved west.

The Christopher Family Tree reports that this Meshack Green born in 1755 in
Baltimore was the son of Isaac Green born 1721 also in Baltimore.  This Isaac
is the son of a John Green in the line of Greens going back to England, and
his wife Mary Samson.  This Isaac is in my genealogy.  It appears from that
gathering evidence that this line of John-Isaac-Meshack is unrelated to the
Meshack and his son Daniel John.

Tenuous
But the line that our Meshack W seems to be from could be related to that line
in Baltimore.  As of February 2012 I had not found a definite connection.  The
Meshack born in Baltimore in 1755 moved to Tennessee and died in Morgan County
on 1 June 1851.  He was married to Susannah Green (also her maiden name).

This Meshack would be a brother to Shadrick reported in other genealogies as
the son of Isaac and Rebecca Green of Baltimore.  One complication in many of
these genealogies is that many have reported on one child of Isaac and Rebecca
or other generations, rather than all the children to give a picture of the
full family.  This makes it hard to confirm siblings and lineage information.

In one genealogy, I did find Isaac Greene as father of all three "Hebrew" boys
Shadrick, Meshack and Abednego.  The birth date of Isaac in 1721 and Meshack
in 1755 in that genealogy eliminated much of the problem of age and generation
matching.  There are many unsatisfactory discrepancies remaining here and in
all genealogies I have seen as sources!  I am not fully comfortable with the
connection of Baltimore with Pendleton District, South Carolina.
--  Judith Chadwell, Christopher Family Tree,
http://trees.ancestry.com/pt/person.aspx?tid=1248604&pid=-1708233696&ftm=1

Disconnections
In July 2008, I removed Meshack b 1720 SC from the line of the Isaac and
Rebecca Green b and d Baltimore, and added Meshack b 1755.  This gave us other
lines to pursue in clarifying these Green lineages, because Judith Chadwell
provides the names of Susannah Green's parents, Steven Green and Jemima Cook. 
Since Susannah was born in South Carolina, it seems likely she is one of the
same lineage as Meshack b 1720 in Pendleton District, SC.

I have, unfortunately, found a large number of genealogies that have Isaac's
son as Meshack W, with birth in 1720, even though they also correctly report
that his father Isaac was not born until a year later in 1721!  How can this
happen?  This kind of boondoggle completely discredits such a genealogy.

There are also some suspicious aspects of the information Judith Chadwell
provides about Meshack (b 1755) and Susannah.  I discuss these in the Notes
for Meshack Green b 1755.  What is the configuration of Meshack and Susannah's
family?  What about Susannah's tie to South Carolina?  Why do these people not
tell us where they got their information and how they put it together?!

It is true almost every family I have been tracing came through either
Pendleton District, SC, or Rutherford County, NC.  But there are too many
niggling details about this Green family situation.  There were many Green(e)
families migrating from various places in the UK into similar areas, and
following the common path southward then westwards.  Meshack W Green and his
wife Lucretia (Creasy) Franklin have been definitely associated with the
Cherokee Greens, and have a fairly certain connection to the Gardner-Green
Cherokee line.

The connection has been somewhat documented by prodigious researcher Troy
Sims, a Gardner Green descendant.  He has relentlessly correlated substantial
circumstantial evidence and records.

It seems to me, on the other hand, that several genealogies have confused the
different lines of Greens, and similarly-named persons, and I have had trouble
clarifying the lineages and relationships.  it is an ongoing project.  The
fact that every generation of brothers named so many of their children the
same names confuses the matter further.  I have not been able to fully sort
out the family lines and generations.  I am working with several other Green
lineage researchers to unravel this conundrum.

The Will
Meshack's will listed wife Creasy [as Creory], sons Thomas, John, Henry,
Daniel, and son in law John Horton. Isaac Horton and John Caldwell also appear
to have been sons in law, Issac Horton moves on to Hall County, Georgia.

Thanks to Keith Henderson of Alabama for finding Meshack's will.  His
information was given to me by a cousin, Glenda Pool.  This has the format of
a database transcription.  Probably from an early service like Genealogy.com,
which was bought by Ancestry.com.

MISHACH GREEN's WILL
Wife Creasy Green
Sons Thomas Green, Daniel Green, Henry Green, Joney Green, John Green
Daughters Nancy Green
Other Heirs John Caldwell [Cadwell], Elizabeth Smith, Issac Horton
Location waters of Coxes' Creek
Executors wife Creasy Green, son Thomas Green
Witnesses George Anderson, Lemiel Thomason, Moley Anderson
Will dated 19 Mar 1798, Probate 24 Jan 1799
Record Book C, p 151, Roll 242
Recorded 24 Jan 1799, roll 461
Pendleton District, South Carolina

A A Smith comments on this transcription, stating that she has a copy of the
handwritten will, and there the name rendered Caldwell in the transcription is
written Cadwell.  This was a known family living in the area, as the comment
below explains.

"In the will of Meshack Green he mentions John Cadwell, not Caldwell.  I am
researching John Cadwell whose older children were born in NC but his younger
children born after 1796 were born in SC..  John Cadwell and his wife Mary
moved to Christian Co. KY in 1806 from Pend. Dist. SC.  They are listed in tax
records in KY as early as 1806.  They had a daughter, Nancy Cadwell, b. 1802
in SC who married John Kesterson in 1819 in Christian Co. KY.  Nancy and John
Kesterson had a son Harvey who was living in the Cherokee Nation.  We believe
they had Indian blood on both sides.  The Kestersons were originally from
Northumberland Co. VA to Fauquier Co. VA to Green Co. TN to Christian Co. KY. 
I always wondered why Meshack Green gave land to John Cadwell.  I have a copy
of the will and it says Cadwell not Caldwell.  John and Mary Cadwell had a
son, John G. Cadwell, b. 1800 SC."
--  A A Smith, Comment on Ancestry.com, 03 Jul 2014

Pendleton District was later divided into smaller counties, and previous
Pendleton Records were housed in Anderson County, South Carolina.

Some sources report a Meshack Green dying in Morgan County, Tennessee, on 1
June 1851.  This would be a different Meshack Green, since we know from the
will that our Meshack died in 1799.  The Tennessee Meshack Green appears to be
from a Baltimore, Maryland line.  It is not clear if the Tennessee Meshack is
part of this same family line or a different one.  It appears that this
Meshack Green from Baltimore was the son of Isaac and Rebecca.

Some genealogies place our Meshack W Green (b 1720) in the place of Isaac and
Rebecca's son Meshack Green (b 1755).  But they can't be the same person. 
There is no record of Meshack W Green ever living in Morgan County, Tennessee.

There is a Meshack Green in the 1810 Federal Census, Rutherford County, North
Carolina, census.  This census report is cited by Glenda Pool, who otherwise
has the earlier dates for Meshack W Green.  This has to be a DIFFERENT,
younger Meshack, since the first one died in 1799.  The date of probating of
the will is 24 January 1799, meaning that Meshack likely died in January 1799. 
Since this is AFTER the death date, the 1810 Meshack is likely a son or
nephew.

Shadrack
No Shadrack has been confirmed as a son of Meshack W Green, whose own father
is also uncertain.  There are three Shadracks in the line of Greens related to
Isaac and connected to the McSwains and others of Cleveland County, North
Carolina.  This lineage is does not appear to be related to the line of
Meshack W Green and Lucretia Franklin.

Shadrack who was born in 1800 has been confused with the Shadrack who was
Meshack W's brother, born sometime in the 1770s.  We know the Shadrack born in
1800 had a son also named Shadrack, born about 1824.

It seems likely that Meshack's son Shadrack has been confused with Shadrack's
son, also named Shadrack, the one born in 1800.  This would mean there are
likely three Shadracks in the line from Meshack W and his brother Shadrack's
generation.

We continue to probe for clarification on this family and the early generation
of Greens in South Carolina, Georgia and points west from there.

I suspect a similar generational confusion with persons named Daniel.

Affirmations
---------------
Finally the real story of Meshack W. Green.  Found Mishack Green's will on the
South Carolina Archives that you talked about in one of your articles online
about Meshack Green, Lucretia Franklin.  I have seen a lot of information and
it's confusing.

Thank you so much for your research and work on these Greens, helping us Green
descendants to understand what is not/what is true.

I am a direct descendant of Louallen/Lewallen Green and Jane Maria Cook,
SC/GA.  Also in this family, Jeremiah Green/Eliza Nalley, South Carolina.
--  Sharon Marshall, comment on this genealogy on Ancestry, 3 August 2016
---------------

From the research of Orville Boyd Jenkins, boydorville@gmail.com

These notes last reviewed and updated 23 September
2019

Birth Notes

Everything we can discern suggests or declares that Meshack W Green was born in
South Carolina, not North Carolina.
Return to Meshack W GREEN










































Notes for Millie GREEN


1850 Federal Census, Cleveland County, North Carolina, 27 August, page 296
(scan 148), Hse/Fam #470
Benjamin Green 41 M Farmer $1000 Real Estate born North Carolina [b abt 1809]
Eliza Green 34 F born North Carolina [b abt 1816]
Elijah Green 18 M Farmer [No Real Estate value] born North Carolina [b abt
1832]
Nancy Green 16 F born North Carolina [b abt 1834]
David O Green 14 M Farmer born North Carolina [b abt 1836]
Sarah A Green 12 F born North Carolina [b abt 1838]
Judith C Green 6 F born North Carolina [b abt 1844]
Rebecca Green 4 F born North Carolina [b abt 1846]
Milly Green 3 F born North Carolina [b abt 1847]
Willis Green 9mos M born North Carolina [b abt Nov 1849]

1860 Federal Census, Rutherford County, North Carolina, 14 June, P O
Unionville, page 29-30, Hse/Fam #1530
B Green 51 M Farmer $950 Real Estate $125 Personal born North Carolina [b abt
1809]
Jane Green 35 (?) F Wife born North Carolina [b abt 1825]
Rubecca Green 15 F born North Carolina [b abt 1845]
Milly Green 13 F born North Carolina [b abt 1847]
Willis Green 11 M born North Carolina [b abt 1849]
William Green 5 M born North Carolina [b abt 1855]
George Green 4 M born North Carolina [b abt 1856]

North Carolina, Deaths, 1906-1930
Millie Green
Death Age 67 yrs, 2 mos, 27 days, Married
Birth 19 April 1847 Cleveland County, North Carolina
Father Benjeman [sic] Green, born Rutherford County, NC
Mother Liza Hamrick, born Cleveland County, NC [was Rutherford County at that
time, Cleveland Co was created in 1841]
Informant Asa Green
Death 16 July 1914 (seems to be at her residence) Township 2, Cleveland
County, North Carolina
Cause of Death Tuberculosis of the bowel, acute for 10 days
Burial 17 July 1914 Cleveland County (no cemetery named), by W A Webb, Shelby,
North Carolina
Certificate #332 filed 6 August 1914 [this date given for filing, but the date
on the doctor's signature is 7 August 1914]
Return to Millie GREEN










































Notes for Milton J GREEN


Milton was reported on a list of children of his parents on his father's
memorial on Find a Grave.

John Thomas Green
Birth Feb. 11, 1844
Death May 15, 1915
Son of Andrew J. Green
Married to Mary R. and had 9 children:
Frances V. Green
Lydia L. Green
Sylvania Green
Isaac Green
James A. Green
J.B. Green
John A. Green
Milton J. Green and
Mary Emmaline Green
--  Find A Grave Memorial #24276858,
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=24276858

The child reported in teh list as Milton J is reported under that name in the
1880 census.

1880 Federal Census, Blount County, Alabama, 15 June, Township 12, District 8,
page 24, Hse #224, Fam #231
Green, John  W M 36 Head Farming GA SC GA [b abt 1844]
Green, Mary R  W F 35 Wife Housekeeping Cannot read or write GA GA GA [abt
1845]
Green, Francis V  R W F 13 Dau At Home Cannot write GA GA GA [abt 1867]
Green, Liddie L  W F 10 Dau At Home Cannot read or write GA GA GA [abt 1870,
but cf age 4 in 1870]
Green, Sylvania  W F 8 Dau At Home AL GA GA [abt 1872]
Green, Isaac W M 7 Son AL GA GA [b abt 1873]
Green, James A  W M 5 Son AL GA GA [b abt 1875]
Green, John A  W M 4 Son AL GA GA [b abt 1876]
Green, Milton J  W M 1 Son AL GA GA [b abt 1879]

A record matches him in the name of J M Green.  J M was enumerated in 1900
next door to his parents John Thomas and Mary Rebecca.  Reported to be age 21,
with a birth date of November 1878.

1900 Federal Census, Blount County, Alabama, 22 June, Nectar, District 2, Page
10A, House #170, Family #171
Green, J M Head W M Nov 1878  21 Married 0 yrs AL GA GA Farmer Rents
Green, Lettie Wife W F Aug 1879  20 Married 0 yrs 10 children/9 living AL AL
AL

His parents and siblings are next door.

1900 Federal Census, Blount County, Alabama, 22 June, Nectar, District 2, Page
10A, House #169, Family #170
Green, John T Head W M Feb 1844 56 Married 34 yrs GA GA GA Farmer Owns
Green, Mary B Wife W F Mar 1845  55 Married 34 yrs 10 children/9 living GA GA
GA
Green, Robert E Son W M Oct 1880  19 Single AL GA GA
Green, Annice E Dau W F Mar 1888  12 Single AL GA GA
Green, Mary E Dau W F Oct 1890  9 Single AL GA GA
Green, Isaac R Nephew W M May 1886  18 Single Farm Laborer AL GA
GA
Return to Milton J GREEN










































Notes for Minnie Lee GREEN


Some sources have spelled Minnie's middle name as Lea.  Niece Lou Ila Gregory
Jenkins spells the middle name as Minnie Lee.  I found also that her name on
her father 's WWI Draft Registration is spelled that way,  when she is listed
as the nearest relative.  The name and the signature match, seeming to
indicate that Joe himself filled out that form.

Minine may have been born in Pontotoc County of Chickasaw Nation.  No record
has been found, but family records report that her youngest brother, Homer,
was born in 1906 in Center in Pontotoc County.  It seems they moved to Marlow
in Pickens County, which in November 1907 became Stephens County, Oklahoma,
some time after Homer's birth.

In 1910, Minnie is 11 years old in the household of her widowed father Joe
(Jorile) Green in Stephens County, Oklahoma, in the Richland township near
Marlow.

1910 Federal Census, Stephens County, Oklahoma, 25 April, Richland Township,
District 243, Page 6B (No House or Family numbers)
Green, Joe Head M W 34 Widowed OK AL AL
Green, Minnie Dau F W 11  OK OK OK

In 1920, 20-year-old Minnie is still living at home with her father Joe
(Toliver Jorile) who has now married the widow Mollie Stroud Williams Lane,

1920 Federal Census, Stephens County, Oklahoma, 2 February, Richland Township,
District 262, page 10A (No house or family numbers given)
Green, Joe T  Head M W 46 OK GA AL Farmer
Green, Mollie  Wife  F W 48  AL AL AL
Green, Minnie Dau  F W 20  OK AL AL

1930 Federal Census, Comanche County, Oklahoma, 7 April, Richards Township,
District 30, page 2A, Hse #26, Fam #27
Thornton, Charley C Head Rents, Owns a radio M W 39 First Married at age 29 OK
MO MO Farmer [b abt 1891]
Thornton, Minnie L Wife F W 30 First Married at age 31 OK TX GA [b abt 1900]

1940 Federal Census, Travis County, Texas, 13 May, Austin, District 227-8A4,
page 63A, Hse #424, Owns $200
Thornton, William M  Head M W 62 Grade C1 b Texas Same house in 1935 Newspaper
correspondent
Thornton, Minnie Lee Wife F W 41 Grade C2 b Texas Same house in 1935
Thornton, Mary Mother F W 87 Single Grade H4 b Louisiana Same house in 1935

Minnie Lee Thornton
Birth May 3, 1899 Center, Pontotoc County, Oklahoma
Death Jan 23, 1941
Parents:
Toliver Jorile Green 1873-1947
Lou Ada Caldonia West Green 1877-1907
Spouse Charles Elvin Thornton 1891-1963
Siblings:
Alpharetta Mae Green Gregory 1895-1963
Birdie Green 1898-1898
Norah Green 1902-1902
David Homer Green 1906-1989
Burial Denton Cemetery, Marlow, Stephens County, Oklahoma
Created by Jean Feb 20, 2007
--  Find A Grave Memorial #18001931,
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/18001931
Return to Minnie Lee GREEN










































Notes for Minnie Lee GREEN


"Minnie Lee Green m. John William Thompson. They are my great grandmother and
grandfather."
--  Cindy Pannell, email to Orville Boyd Jenkins, 28 September 2010

Millennium File
Minnie Lee Green
Spouse John William Thompson
Birth 1874 Marietta, Love County, Oklahoma
Death 1938 McFarland, Kern County, California
One Child is listed in this file, Charles William Thompson

Minnie and her husband John William Thompson were recorded with their family
in the 1900 Federal census in Chickasaw Nation.  Living with them is Minnie's
nephew, Daniel David Green, son of Jackson Green and brother of Minnie's
father, also named Daniel David Green.  The percentage and tribe are reported
in this census.

The enumerator had a problem with fraction mathematics here, which shows up in
other entries.  The children are actually reported as a higher percentage of
Choctaw than the mother, even though their father is White!  Note below that
in 1910, Minnie herself is reported as only 1/8 Indian (corrected to Chickasaw
this time), while in 1900 she is reported as 3/4, even though her father
Daniel David Green was White.

1900 Federal Census, Chickasaw Nation, Indian Territory, 13 June, Township 4,
North Range 2E, District 134, page 22B, Hse #13, Fam #14
Thompson, Jno W  Head W M June 1846 33 Married 10 years  Mosouri [sic] Mosouri
Mosouri Farmer
Thompson, Minnie G Wife In F (3/4 Choctaw) Jan 1874 26 Married 10 years  5
children/5 living Indian Territory Indian Territory Unknown
Thompson, Mammie G  Dau In F  (7/8 Choctaw) Sept 1891  8 Indian Territory 
Mosouri  Indian Territory
Thompson, Robert Lee  Son In (7/8 Choctaw) M  June 1892  7 Indian Territory 
Mosouri  Indian Territory
Thompson, Charles W  Son In (7/8 Choctaw) M  July 1894  5 Indian Territory 
Mosouri  Indian Territory
Thompson, Emma A  Dau In (7/8 Choctaw) F  Apr 1897  3 Indian Territory 
Mosouri  Indian Territory
Thompson, Jessie M  Dau In (7/8 Choctaw) F  June 1899  11mos Indian Territory 
Mosouri  Indian Territory
Green, Daniel D  Servant  W M  (Both Parents White) May 1883  16 Single 
Indian Territory (No birth place given for parents) Farm Laborer

Minnie and her children are registered in the 1902 Indian census.  They are
now correctly reported as Chickasaw.  Earlier when they were living in Choctaw
Nation, they had been registered as Choctaw, thus the report in 1900 as
Choctaw.  Originally the Chickasaw and Chickasaw shared the same land areas,
and it was later divided into the separate National identities.

U.S. Native American Enrollment Cards for the Five Civilized Tribes,
1898-1914, www.ancestry.com
Tribal Affiliation Chickasaw By Blood for All
25 Sep 1902, Dawes' Roll #4318, Census Card #1616
Minnie Lee Thompson, Age 23, Birth Abt 1879, 1/4 Chickasaw
25 Sep 1902, Dawes' Roll #4319, Census Card #1616
Mamie Frances Thompson, Age 11, Birth Abt 1891, 1/8 Chickasaw
25 Sep 1902, Dawes' Roll #4320, Census Card #1616
Robert Lee Thompson, Age 9, Birth Abt 1893, 1/8 Chickasaw
25 Sep 1902, Dawes' Roll #4321, Census Card #1616
Emma Augusta Thompson, Age 5, Birth Abt 1897, 1/8 Chickasaw
25 Sep 1902, Dawes' Roll #4322, Census Card #1616
Jessie May Thompson, Age 3, Birth Abt 1899, 1/8 Chickasaw

Chickasaw Roll, Citizens By Blood 1903
Roll #4315  East, Frances 71 F  1/2  Census Card #1615
Roll #4316  Green, Daniel 26 M  1/4  Census Card #1615
Roll #4317  Adams, Charles 22 M  1/4  Census Card #1615

Roll #4318 Thompson, Minnie Lee 28 F  1/4  Census Card #1616
Roll #4319 Thompson, Mamie Frances 11 F  1/8  Census Card #1616
Roll #4320 Thompson, Robert Lee 9 M  1/8  Census Card #1616
Roll #4321 Thompson, Emma Augusta 5 F  1/8  Census Card #1616
Roll #4322 Thompson, Jessie May 3 F  1/8  Census Card #1616

Roll #4323 Chochran, William Hunter 34 M  1/4  Census Card #1617
Roll #4324 Chochran, Willie 7 M  1/8  Census Card #1617
Roll #4325 Chochran, Vertis 7 M  1/8  Census Card #1617
Roll #4326 Chochran, Samuel T 2 M  1/8  Census Card #1617

1910 Federal Census, McClain County, Oklahoma, 2 May, Hopping Township,
District 185, page 2A, Hse/Fam #7
Thompson, Minnie Head F Ind (1/8 Chickasaw)  35 Widow 5 children/5 living OK
US OK Own Income Owns Farm
Thompson, Robert Lee Son M Ind (1/16 Chickasaw)  16 Single OK TX OK Farm
Laborer Can Read and Write [b abt 1894]
Thompson, Charlie Son M Ind (1/16 Chickasaw)  14 OK TX OK Farm Laborer Can
Read and Write [b abt 1896]
Thompson, Emma A Dau F Ind (1/16 Chickasaw)  13 Single OK TX OK No Occupation
Can Read and Write [b abt 1897]
Thompson, Jessie M Dau F Ind (1/16 Chickasaw)  10 Single OK TX OK No
Occupation Can Read and Write [b abt 1900]
Jones, Claud Hired Man M White 31 Single TX US US Farm Laborer Can Read and
Write

Though Minnie and her children were identified as Chickasaw in the 1910
census, in 1920 and 1930, her son Charley in her household is reported as
White.  We find that Minnie has married again, to another White man James L
Jones.  Claud J in the 1920 census seems to be the same man, despite a
difference in age, (which we find often in censuses).  There is a new child
here that did not appear in the 1900 census.

1900 census birthdays are usually wrong, often by one year but sometimes by
two years.  For instance in 1900 Robert Lee is reported born in 1892, but his
age in the Dawes rolls puts his birth in 1893, and his 1910 age makes him born
in about 1894.

In late July 2012, my cousin and coresercher Marion Mixon discovered the
marriage record for Minnie Lee and one J C Jones in Lamar County, Texas,
matching the name sequence James Claude.  Lamar County is south of the Red
River opposite McClain County, Oklahoma, where they lived north of the river.

Marriage Record for J. C. Jones
Spouse Minnie Thompson
16 Nov 1910 Lamar County, Texas
--  RootsWeb Marriage Records,
http://userdb.rootsweb.ancestry.com/marriages/cgi-bin/marriage.cgi?main_id=11049&database=Marriage%20Records&return_to=http://userdb.rootsweb.com/marriages/&submitter_id=

1920 Federal Census, McClain County, Oklahoma, 3 January, Hopping Township,
District 78, page 1B, Hse/Fam #16
Jones, Claud J Head  Owns Farm M W 35 OK TX TX Farmer [b abt 1885]
Jones, Minnie  Wife F W 38 OK OK OK [b abt 1882]
Jones, George Son M W 8 Single OK OK OK [b abt 1912]
Thompson, Charley Step-Son M W 23 Single OK TX OK [b abt 1897] Farmer

In 1930, Minnie's husband is reported as James L Jones.  Cindy Pannell has the
name of Minnie's second husband as James Lewis Claud Jones.

1930 Federal Census, McClain County, Oklahoma, 15 April, Moncrief Township,
District 8, page 8B, Hse #121, Fam #126
Jones, James L Head Rents M W 51 First Married at 31 yrs old TX TX TX Farmer
[b abt 1879]
Jones, Minnie L Wife F W 55 First Married at 19 yrs old OK TX OK [b abt 1875]
Thompson, Charles W Stepson M W 34 Widowed OK TX OK Laborer [b abt 1896]
Jones, George D Son M W 19 Single OK TX OK [b abt 1911]
Thompson, Lawanda B Step-GrandDau F W 7 Single OK OK US [b abt 1923]

The Millenium Files collection of Ancestry.com (cited above) reports Minnie
died in October 1938 in Kern County, California.  L Sherman reports more
specifically that Minnie died Oct 1938 in McFarland, Kern, California, where
other members of the Green family had moved.
--  Ancestry Trees L Sherman, http://trees.ancestry.com/pt/pid=-1984798304

Family Data Collection - Individual Records
Minnie Lee Green
Spouse John William Thompson
Parents Daniel Green, Francis Colbert
Birth 1874 Marietta, Love, OK
Death 1938 Mcfarland, Kern, CA

California, Death Index, 1905-1939
Minnie L Jones
Age at Death 64, Birth Year abt 1874
Death 26 Oct 1938 Kern County

I added details and links from my research on the memorial for Minnie on Find
a Grave when I found it.  The updated memorial follows.

------------------
Minnie Jones
Birth Jun. 12, 1874 Marietta, Love County, Oklahoma
Death Oct, 1938 McFarland, Kern County, California

Parents:
Daniel David Green (1844 - 1878)
Francis Colbert Green East (1831 - 1915)
Spouses:
J. W. [John William] Thompson (1866 - 1907)
James Claud Lewis Jones (1879 - 1935)
Siblings:
Samuel T Cochran (1866 - 1886) Half-sibling
R. J. Green (1872 - 1906)
Rosebud Green (1876 - 1876)
Robert Louis Green (1877 - 1877)
Emma A. Green (1878 - 1892)

Burial North Kern Cemetery, Delano, Kern County, California

Created by Diane & John Sep 02, 2011
--  Find A Grave Memorial #75860348,
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=75860348
------------------

Written by Orville Jenkins on 10 Nov 2010
Last updated 23 November
2015
Return to Minnie Lee GREEN










































Notes for Minor Brown GREEN


1850 Federal Census, Hall County, Georgia, 1 August, District 38, page 334B,
Hse/Fam #11
Thomas Green 44 M Miller b SC
Mary Green 38 F b SC
A F Green 21 M Miller b Hall Co
E B Green 19 F b Hall Co
N E Green 16 M b Hall Co
M M Green 13 F b Hall Co
J A Green 12 M b Hall Co
M B Green 10 M b Hall Co
G P Green 7 M b Hall Co
E I Green 5 M b Hall Co
N P Green 1 M b Hall Co

1860 Federal Census, Saline County, Arkansas, 14 June, Saline Township, page
28, Hse/Fam #177
Thomas Green 46 Farmer $0 Real Estate $300 Personal born South Carolina [b abt
1814]
Mary Green 44 F Farmer born South Carolina Cannot read or write [b abt 1839]
Nancy Green 24 F Farmer born South Carolina Cannot read or write [b abt 1836]
Martha Green 23 F Farmer born Georgia Cannot read or write [b abt 1837]
James Green 22 M Farmer born Georgia Cannot read or write [b abt 1838]
Union Green 19 M Farmer born Georgia [b abt 1841]
Gifford Green 17 M Farmer born Georgia [b abt 1843]
Irvin Green 14 M Farmer born Georgia [b abt 1846]
Perry N Green 12 M Farmer born Georgia [b abt 1848]

A genealogy by Richard Bates provides more complete names for most children of
Thomas Perry and Mary Elizabeth Green.  He has twpo chidlren where only one
occurs int eh 1860 census, name Minor in Ancestry's transcripotin.  Their are
fasded pen strokes on even entry on the census page, making it difficult to
decipher some names, which was never a strong suit of Ancestry's transcriptoin
and indexing.  The strokes, and comparison with other names and letters on the
census page indicates the entry was Minor, matching the more complete name
provided for Bates.  It appears the entries for Union and Minor Brown are for
the same child.  No other chidlr apepars in the census between James and
Gifford.

John McAfee GREEN b: 12 OCT 1827 in Gainesville, Hall Co., GA
A. F. GREEN b: 1829 in Hall Co., GA
Daniel Thomas GREEN b: 1830 in Hall Co.,GA
Eliza B. GREEN b: 1831 in Hall Co., GA
Nancy Elvira GREEN b: 1833 in Hall Co., GA
Martha Mattie GREEN b: 1837 in Hall Co., GA
James A. GREEN b: 1838 in Hall Co., GA
Minor Brown GREEN b: 1840 in Hall Co., GA [appears to be the same child as
Union; names are faded on the census page, only one year difference in
estimated birth years]
Union GREEN b: 1841 in Hall Co., GA  [appears to be the same child as Minor,
based on the transcription "Union" in the 1860 census; names are faded on the
census page]
Gilford Perry GREEN b: 1843 in Hall Co., GA
Edward Irvin GREEN b: 1845 in Hall Co., GA
Nathan Perry GREEN b: 1849 in Hall Co., GA
--  Bates,
http://awt.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=rbbates1302004&id=I02824
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Notes for Miriam GREEN


"JOHN THOMAS GREEN, SP MARY ELIZABETH (REBECCA) STANDRIDGE, DAU MIRIAM SMITH
STANDRIDGE (wife of ISAAC A )"
--   Comment by jk on a FAG memorial 11 Apr 2009,
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=24276858

The above comment seems to mean that Mary Elizabeth Rebeccas's paretns were
Isaac A Standridge and Miriam Smith.  Other information reports her mother was
Sarah Emeline Hall.
Return to Miriam GREEN










































Notes for Missouri Gertrude GREEN


The Tanneyhill genealogy reports the following information about Missouri.

Missouri Gertrude
Birth: 8 Jan 1887 in Platte, MO
Death: 1 Dec 1936 in Pauls Valley, Garvin Co., OK
Father: John GREEN b: 14 Feb 1851 in Platte, MO
Mother: Margarette Jane KILMER b: 8 Nov 1858 in Douglas Co., MO
--  Tanneyhill, McKinney and Wolfe, Christy, Wolf,
http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=:3306591&id=I630744231

A couple of other genealogies report she was born in Missouri City, Fort Bend
County, Texas.  This is near Houston.  No genealogy tells where they got these
locations.  perhaps the report of Missouri as the birthplace is due to a
confusion with Missouri City in Texas.  She could have been named after either
the state or the city.  Here is Steve Lynch's information on Missouri Green.

Missouri Gertrude Green
Birth 8 Jan 1887 in Missouri City, Fort Bend, Texas
Death 1 Dec 1936 in Pauls Valley, Garvin, Oklahoma
--  Lynch-Darling Family Tree,
http://trees.ancestry.com/tree/243986/person/-91686363?ssrc=&ftm=1

Census reports support the Missouri birthplace.  In 1900 John and his family
are in Faulkner County, Arkansas, and the child Gertrude M, matching the child
reported in these genealogies as Gertrude Missouri, is reported as born in
Missouri.  The two older children still in the household, James and Myrtle,
are both reported as born in Texas.

1900 Federal Census, Faulkner County, Arkansas, 15 June, cypress Township,
District 27, Page 7B, House #138, Family #142
Green, John  Head W M Feb 1851 49  Married 22 years MO MO TN Farmer  Owns Farm
Green, Margaret J  Wife W F Nov 1858 41  Married 22 years  9 children/8 living
MO TN TN
Green, James I  Son W M Nov 1880  19 Single TX MO MO Farm Laborer
Green, Myttle [sic] L  Dau W F Mar 1884  16 Single TX MO MO
Green, Gertrude M  Dau W F Jan 1887  13 Single MO MO MO

1910 Federal Census, Garvin County, Oklahoma, 28 April, Whitebead Township,
District 88, page 5B, Hse/Fam #73
Green, John  Head M W 59 Married 32 years MO MO TN Farmer Rents [b abt 1851]
Green, Margarete J Wife F W 52 Married 32 years 10 children/9 living MO TN TN
[b abt 1858]
Green, Missouri G Dau F W 23 Single MO MO MO [b abt 1887]

It appears that by 1920, Missouri is now going by her middle name Gertrude.

1920 Federal Census, Garvin County, Oklahoma, 5 March, Stratford, District 35,
page 9A,  Hse #133, Fam #134
Green, John  Head  Rents  M W 69 Married MO MO MO Farmer
Green, Margarite J Wife F W 61 Married MO MO MO No Occupation
Green, Gertrude Dau F W 27 Single MO MO MO No Occupation

1930 Federal Census, Murray County, Oklahoma, 4 April, Allen Township,
District 1, page 2A, Hse/#16
Greene, John Head Rents 79  First married at age 26 MO MO TN Farmer
Greene, Margaret J  71  First married at age 19  MO TN TN No Occupation
Mahan, Gertrude Dau 43 Widowed MO MO MO No
Occupation
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Notes for Myrtle E GREEN


1900 Federal Census, Parker County, Texas, 6 June, Justice Precinct 2, District
70, page 3A-3B, Hse #40, Fam #44
Green, Raleigh Head W M  Dec 1866 33 Married 9 yrs TX GA GA Farmer Owns
Green, Ellen Wife W F Jan 1871  29 Married 9 yrs 5 children/5 living GA GA GA
Green, Arville Son W M Apr 1892  8 Single TX TX GA
Green, Charles Son W M Nov 1893  6 Single TX TX GA
- page 8B -
Green, Myrtle E Dau W F May 1895  5 Single TX TX GA
Green, Claude Son W M June 1897  2 Single TX TX GA
Green, William Son W M Apr 1899 1 Single TX TX GA
Green, Alford M Father W M Nov 1833  65 Widowed GA GA
GA
Return to Myrtle E GREEN










































Notes for Myrtle Emma GREEN


1900 Federal Census, Chickasaw Nation, Indian Territory, 2 June, Township 8,
South Range 1 East, District 151, page 1A, Hse #2
Green, Reddick J  Head White Male Feb 1869  31 Married 12 yrs Ind Territory GA
Ind Territory  Farmer  Owns Farm  Cannot read and write
Green, Etta L  Wife White Female Nov 1869  30 Married 12 yrs  3 children/2
living MS TN AL Can read and write
Green, William A  Son White Male Aug 1890  9 Ind Territory Ind Territory
Mississippi
Green, Myrtle E Dau  White Female Dec 1892  7 Ind Territory Ind Territory
Mississippi

Myrtle was registered with other members of her family in the Dawes Chickasaw
Nation Roll.

U.S. Native American Enrollment Cards for the Five Civilized Tribes, 1898-1914
Dawes Chickasaw Roll, Chickasaw Nation, Indian Territory, 25 Sep 1902
Census Card #1662, Dawes' Roll #4064
Myrtle Emma Green
Birth Year abt 1892
Age at Census Enrollment 12
Enrollment Date 25 Sep 1902
Chickasaw By Blood, 1/8

Myrtle Emma Green
Birth 2 DEC 1892 in Indian Territory
Death 1 NOV 1948 in Marion, Oregon [but see below]
Parents:
REDDICK JACKSON GREEN 1872 - 1906
Etta D Bower 1869 - 1949
Marriage to 8 Mar 1908 Andrew Julius Powell
Son Melvin D.C. Powell
Birth June 5, 1919 in Oklahoma
Death 27 Jul 2000 in De Kalb, Bowie, Texas
--  Bishop Family,
http://trees.ancestry.com/tree/21181282/person/1052380761?ssrc=&ftm=1

1920 Federal Census, Johnston County, Oklahoma, 11 February, Thomas Township,
District 97, page 17B, Hse/Fam #330
Powell, Andy Head Rents M W 28 AR AR TN Farmer
Powell, Myrtle E Wife F W 26 OK OK MS
Powell, Daniel R Son M W 11 OK AR OK
Powell, Ambrose Son M W 10 OK AR OK
Powell, Lucille  Dau F W 9 OK AR OK
Powell, Manto R Dau F W 7 OK AR OK
Powell, W B Son M W 5 OK AR OK
Powell, D C Son M W 6mos OK AR OK

1930 Federal Census, Red River County, Texas, 14 April, Precinct 6, District
21, page 8A, Hse #165, Fam #171
Powel, Andy J Head Rents M W 42 Married at age 20 AR AR AR Farm Laborer
Powel, Myrtle Wife F W 37 Married at age 15 OK OK MS
Powel, Ambrose Son M W 19 Single OK AR OK Farm Laborer
Powel, Luciele Dau F W 18 Single OK AR OK
Powel, W B Son M W 13 Single OK AR OK
Powel, D C Son M W 10 Single OK AR OK
Powel, Julious Son M W 6 Single OK AR OK
Powel, Wandasue Dau F W 1yr6mos Single OK AR OK [b abt Aug 1927]
Henry, Pat Boarder M W 33 Single AR AR AR Farm Laborer

1940 Federal Census, Bowie County, Texas, 9 April, Justice Precinct 3,
District 19-25, page 5B, Spring Hill & River Rd, Hse #93, Rents $2
Powell, Andy J  Head M W 50 Grade 2 b Arkansas Rural Bowie County in 1935
Farmer
Powell, Myrtle Wife F W 48 Grade 4 b Oklahoma Rural Bowie County in 1935
Powell, William B Son M W 23 Grade 2 b Oklahoma Rural Bowie County in 1935
Farm Laborer
Powell, Melvin D Son M W 21 Grade 2 b Oklahoma Rural Bowie County in 1935 Farm
Laborer
Powell, Julious Son M W 16 Grade 7 b Oklahoma Rural Bowie County in 1935 No
Occup
Powell, Wanda Sue Dau F W 12 Grade 3 b Oklahoma Rural Bowie County in 1935 No
Occup
Green, Daniel Brother-in-Law M W 72 Grade 0 b Oklahoma Rural Bowie County in
1935 No Occup

This Daniel Green, as age 72,  is the brother of Myrtle's father, and so her
uncle, and Andy's uncle-in-law.  But he was also married to Andy's sister
Sarah, so he is Andy's brother-in-law, as reported here.  But his reported age
points up the discrepancies and confusion in family and official reports about
Daniel and his older brother Reddick Green, also confusingly reported in some
genealogies as Daniel.

Some genealogies have only one son with the name Daniel Reddic or variations
like Redric.  It appears that Reddick Jackson Green was born in 1869, and
Daniel in about 1872.  So we would expect Daniel's age in 1940 to be about 68.

All the genealogies I have seen that have a death date for Myrtle report her
death was in Oregon in 1948.  This information is found in the Oregon Death
Index.  The difficulty with this is that the last name is her maiden name and
not her married name.  We would expect her to be Myrtle Emma Powell.  The
Oregon record is for Myrtle E Green.

Oregon, Death Index, 1898-2008
Certificate #12554
Myrtle E Green
Death 1 Nov 1948 Marion County

It appears the genealogies have just all copied from each other without
analyzing fully.  In December 2012 my cousin Marion Mixon found an alternative
record in Washington state that has very close details to our Myrtle Emma.

Washington, Deaths, 1883-1960
Myrtle Emmer Powell [Myrtle Emmer Green]
Birth Date abt 1892
Death 20 Oct 1946 Vancouver, Clark, Washington
Age at Death 54
Father Dutch Green
Mother Etta Bowens
Washington State Death Records

The middle name here is Emmer, an obvious form of Emma, representing the
dialectic pronunciation we have commonly heard.  The surnames of her parents
match, though I do not have other information that her father Reddick Jackson
was called by the nickname Dutch.

Her mother's maiden name is normally found as Bowers, and this Bowens could be
a transcription from a handwritten record that was misread.  Also, the Bowers
name was formerly found as Bowen, but was changed along the way to Bower or
Bowers.

I have not found any further details about a move to the Northwest or other
confirmations.  Note that this record of death is only 6 years after they were
recorded in the 1940 Census in Bowie County, Texas.
Return to Myrtle Emma GREEN










































Notes for Myrtle Margaret GREEN


An old photo of Margaret in the possession of Janet Green Ariciu has a
handwritten identification by someone in the family reading "Margaret Green
daughter of Uncle Fred and Aunt Myrtle."

Myrtle Margaret Green
Birth 27 May 1919
Death 26 Mar 1939 (aged 19)
Burial Mount Olivet Cemetery, Pauls Valley, Garvin County, Oklahoma, Section
1, Plot 6
Parents:
Allen Frederick Green 1889-1961
Myrtle Carr Green 1894-1960
Siblings:
Isam Coy Green 1921-1974
Velma Opa Green Blue 1923-1983
John Martin Green 1925-1985
Jerry Allen Green 1930-1988
Created by Susan B 24 Feb 2019
--  Find a Grave Memorial 197089465,
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/197089465/myrtle-margaret-green
Return to Myrtle Margaret GREEN










































Notes for Nancy GREEN


1850 Federal Census, Cleveland County, North Carolina, 27 August, page 296
(scan 148), Hse/Fam #470
Benjamin Green 41 M Farmer $1000 Real Estate born North Carolina [b abt 1809]
Eliza Green 34 F born North Carolina [b abt 1816]
Elijah Green 18 M Farmer [No Real Estate value] born North Carolina [b abt
1832]
Nancy Green 16 F born North Carolina [b abt 1834]
David O Green 14 M Farmer born North Carolina [b abt 1836]
Sarah A Green 12 F born North Carolina [b abt 1838]
Judith C Green 6 F born North Carolina [b abt 1844]
Rebecca Green 4 F born North Carolina [b abt 1846]
Milly Green 3 F born North Carolina [b abt 1847]
Willis Green 9mos M born North Carolina [b abt Nov
1849]
Return to Nancy GREEN