Some genealogies show this Henry Le Strange (born 1432) as a son of John Le
Strange (born 1387) and a brother to Roger Le Strange (born 1412). This seems
to be an error, however, according to the Le Strange dynasty lineage on the Le
Strange Family Website. I am following their information to show Henry as a
son of Robert and grandson of John. The age of Robert using the dates of
birth commonly shown in genealogies matches for this relationship, with Robert
being about 20 years old (born 1412) at the reported year of birth of Henry
(born 1432).
The Tudorplace Le Strange genealogy gives a marriage date of "abt 1434" for
Roger le Strange and Jane (Joan) Beke. But the Le Strange (of Hunstanton)
Website, which has no marriage date, gives the birth date for Henry as 1431.
An anonymous source, with no documentation included, provides a date of 1432
for Henry's birth, still earlier than the reported marriage of his parents.
The Tudorplace date for Henry's birth is also 1432.
Henry Le STRANGE of Hunstanton (Sir)
Born: 1432, Hunstanton, Norfolk, England
Died: 25 Nov 1485, Hunstanton, Norfolk, England
Father: Roger Le STRANGE of Hunstanton
Mother: Jane BEKE
Married: Catherine DRURY ABT 1465
-- Tudorplace, http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/STRANGE.htm#Henry Le STRANGE of
Hunstanton (Sir)1
The Tudorplace site also reports the birth date of 1432 for Henry, with no
comment or explanation. They have Roger's son John born in 1435 and Hamon in
1441. Clues can be gleaned from these sites, but the lack of specific
documentation or discussion limits the credibility and authority of such
sites.
Other children of John were born in the ear of 1412-17. It does not seem
likely there was a long break of 15 years, then Henry was born. Reported
dates of birth for Henry match the years of marriage of Roger and Joan and
their children more closely. The birth of Roger's first son John is pretty
commonly reported as about 1435. Leaning towards Henry's identity as a son of
Roger, rather than Roger's father John, I have estimated the birth year for
Henry to be after the marriage date and birth of brother John within a year in
1435.
In regard to the Tudorplace date of birth for Henry, It seems odd that a
sources that reports him as the son of Roger and Joan would still report a
date of birth before their marriage. This seems highly unlikely for a noble
family, at least officially. Henry appears in all references to be considered
a legitimate heir. We would expect the term Fitz to be included in his family
name if he was illegitimate.
Originally the term Fitz (as in the famous Fitzalan family) was used in its
rightful meaning as Son of, comparable to the Irish-Scots Mac, Welsh Ap and
the French De with father's name. The term Fitz (Germanic-Norman for "son
of") came to be used to identify an illegitimate son. This practice arose
because it was commonly accepted that kings and noble men would have
concubines and mistresses. The formalities of monogamy required by the Roman
Church were honored officially by limiting inheritance of feudal lands and
titles to legitimate first sons, or lacking sons, in many cases, to the
daughters in order of birth.
Illegitimate sons would be given their own estates and thus the common feudal
title of Lord, but with no styling of a dynastic Barony. In some cases,
however, kings would bestow (or have Parliament bestow) baronies upon such a
Fitzroy (son of the King) or Fitzpatrick (son of a noble) in his own right.
Such a name-form is not used in sources for Henry Le
Strange.
Most sources report no place of birth for Hoel. I have followed the Astill
Family Tree to report Norfolk as the place of birth, since all we know about
his descendants is related to Norfolk. There is much legend associated with
this character, and many popular genealogies have tried to associate him with
Hoel V, Count of Cornouaille in Brittany.
This may be so, but the reported dates do not match, since Hoel LeStrange is
repooted to have lived until 1089, while the undocumented date of the supposed
marriage of Hawsie to Hoel V County of Cornouaille is said to have occurred in
1066, the same year that William the Conqueror landed in Britain and claimed
the crown of England.
Some also identify Hoel LeStrange withy Hoel V County of Cornouaille in
Brittany. But this appears to be an attempt to prise this historical figure
Hoel LeStrange into the mold of the medieval romance tale that associates Guy
Le Strange with the Count of Brittany. Such tales were normally fictional
stories woven around the name or legend of a historical personage.
Remember also that the troubadourian (trouverian) musical romance story of Guy
LeStrange was written several centuries later. Most sources I have seen seem
to force this connection to make Hoel Le Strange the same person as Hoel V of
Brittany, as the father of the historical Guy LeStrange. No evidence has been
found to support such an identification.
For similar reasons, we have been able to find no valid older connection for
Hoel Le Strange. His parentage and direct ancestry are unknown, despite some
fanciful fictions circulating in romantic popular genealogies.
Hoel Le Strange
Born in 1022 - Norfolk, England
Deceased in 1089 - Norfolk, England , age at death: 67 years old
Married to Hawsie ?
Son Guy Le Strange 1048-1105
-- Mitchell BERGER ,
http://gw.geneanet.org/index.php3?b=mberger256&lang=en;p=hoel;n=le+strange
Through Joan, the Barony of Strange of Knockin passes into the Stanley family
when she marries George Stanley. Joan inherited the title of 9th Baroness
Lady Strange Strange of Knockin. Her husband George become the 9th Lord
Strange of Knockin. Their son Thomas Stanley was the 2nd Earl of Derby and
became the 10th Lord Strange of Knockin.
-----------------
Lady Joan Lestrange Stanley
Birth 1463
Death Mar. 20, 1514
Parents:
John Lestrange (1444 - 1479)
Jacquette Wydeville Lestrange
Spouse George Stanley (1460 - 1503)
Children:
James Stanley
Thomas Stanley (____ - 1521)
Burial St John the Baptist Churchyard, Hillingdon, London Borough of
Hillingdon, Greater London, England, In the Chancel of the Church
Created by Todd Whitesides Jan 18, 2013
-- Find a Grave Memorial #103746312,
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=103746312
-----------------
The Le Strange Web Site styles this John as John le Strange [III] of Knockin.
"John le Strange [III] of Knockin [d.1269]"
-- Le Strange Website, Descent,
http://www.ls.u-net.com/le_Strange/Seat-H2.htm
---------------------
John Le STRANGE
Born: ABT 1194, Ness And Ches, Shropshire, England
Died: 26 Mar 1269, Knockyn, Warwick, England
Father: John Le STRANGE
Mother: Amice ?
Married: Lucy De TREGOZ (b. ABT 1210 - d. 1294)
Children:
1. John Le STRANGE (1º B. Strange of Knockin)
2. Hamon Le STRANGE
3. Robert Le STRANGE
4. Catherine Le STRANGE
5. Hawise Le STRANGE
6. Roger Le STRANGE of Ellesmere
-- Tudor Place, Strange Family, http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/STRANGE.htm#John
Le STRANGE3
---------------------
My friend and co-researcher David Rittenhouse has collected several sources
that outline important details about the life of John le Strange III, Lord of
Shropshire and Knockin.
Lord of Ness and Chesewardine in Shropshire; Sheriff of Shropshire in 1219;
youngest son.
[Roll of Battle Abbey, p. 50]
Lord Strange of Knockyn; d. by 1269; m. Lucy de Tregoz; father of John
Lestrange IV.
[Ancestral Roots, p. 228]
Lord Strange of Knockyn; d. by 1269; m. Lucy Tregoz; father of John Lestrange
IV.
[Charlemagne & Others, Chart 2931]
m. Lucy de Tregoz; father of Robert Le Strange who m. Eleanor de Whitechurch.
[WFT vol 11 Ped 3809]
Son of John Le Strange II; m. Lucy Tregoz; father of:
1. Robert who m. Alianore Whitechurch
2. Hawyse who m. Griffith ap Gwenwynwyn
3. Katherine who m. Sir Robert Corbet
[WFT Vol 1 Ped 986]
In 1242 John L'Estrange, justice of Chester, had the custody of the lands late
of John Fitz-Alan, and possibly in that capacity was returned in 1242-3 as
holding 1 fee in Drayton of the earl of Arundel. In 1244 the service of the
same John L'Estrange of 1/2 fee in Drayton was assigned to the pourparty of
Roger de Somery and Nichola his wife...
[Honors and Knights' Fees, vol. III, as quoted by John P. Ravilious
The Le Strange Web Site styles this John as John le Strange [II] of Knockyn.
This site says he died on or before 20 January 1234, while the Corbet
genealogy says he died about 1237.
-- Corbet-Le Strange Genealogy,
http://www.renderplus.com/hartgen/htm/le-strange.htm
John is styled as "John le Strange [I] of Great Ness, Shropshire."
-- The Le Strange
Website
Some genealogies I have seen show Roger (born abt 1412) and Henry (born 1432)
as brothers, both being sons of John (born 1387). However, the Le Strange
Website genealogy, showing the lineage of the Knockin-Hunstanton family,
reports that Henry is the SON of Roger. This would match the birth dates
given in the other sources. At the reported birth year of Henry, Roger, son
of John would be about 20. This seems to be the reasonable resolution of
this.
I am following the Le Strange dynasty genealogy on this and reporting Henry
(born 1432) as son of Roger (born abt 1412) son of John (born 1387).
It gets quite confusing tying to line out and keep straight the generations of
this family, because almost every son gives almost the same names in every
generation to his sons.
The Le Strange Web Site styles this John as John le Strange [IV] of Knockin.
The Tudorplace genealogy of the Le Stranges of Knockin begins the Barony with
this John, making him 1st Baron Lord Strange of Knockin (Knockyn). All other
sources I have found, including the heritage listing in the Le Strange
Website, indicate that the Barony began with this John's son, John V of
Knockin.
This Tudorplace source has much detail about some persons and the
establishment of various Baronies. Yet this is the only source that indicates
the Knockin Barony beginning in this generation.
I am showing the Barony of Strange of Knockin beginning as all other sources
show it, with John V (born abt 1253).
The Tudorplace Le Strange genealogy has excellent historical detail on this
John Le Strange and his relationships and his involvement in the royal affairs
and changes of government in England. He was associated with Kings Richard II
and Henry IV and Henry, Earl of Derby (son of John of Gaunt, who became the
King of Castille through marriage).
-- Tudorplace,
http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/STRANGE.htm
There is a discrepancy between the Hunstanton Le Strange Website and the
Tudorplace Le Strange genealogy on the birth place of Roger and John, the
children of Henry Le Strange and Catherine Drury. They agree that Robert was
born in Elsing Hall (his title is Robert Le Strange of Elsing).
But the Le Strange website reports Elsing Hall for the two brothers as well,
and has no location for sister Ann. The Tudorplace genealogy reports
different birthplaces for the three brothers, while Ann was born on the same
estate as Roger, Pakenham.
John is styled, in the common form related to birth estate, John Le Strange of
Massingham.
I am following the Tudorplace source, which has much careful detail and
explanation, while the Le Strange website is spotty and inconsistent and lacks
many dates and other details.
The source showing John as a child of Fulk I, Baron Strange, also has Elizabeth
as a daughter. The GenServ Genealogy Library has Elizabeth as a daughter and
also reports only one son, but it is Fulk II.
Another source shows a daughter Eleonor Le Strange, but provides no birth or
death information. This child is reported to have married Reynolt de Grey
(b1323 d 1388).
-- Angel Streur, GeneaNet genealogy,
http://gw.geneanet.org/index.php3?b=dragonladys&lang=en&n=N&v=Le%20Strange
John inherited the lands, and used the titled also thought to be inherited from
his brother Fulk. He was personally "summoned" to Parliament under a new
writ, for titlement under a technically new Barony. The numbering of the
Barony of Lord Strange of Blackmere normally is continued in sequence from the
original Barony of Blackmere.
-- http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/STRANGE.htm
One source says that the father of John Le Strange, 3rd Lord Strange of
Blackmere, was Eubolo Le Strange and Alice De Lancy. But sources within the
family, Le Strange and Corbet, report he is the son of John 2nd Lord Strange
and Ankaret Butler. I have not seen any reference to Eubolo holding the title
of Lord Strange of Blackmere. It would be expected that the title would be
handed down father to son, or otherwise to a brother if the Lord died without
issue. John inherited the title from his brother Fulk, 3rd Lord Strange of
Blackmere, who had no heir. They had no brother named Eubolo, according to
sources I have seen, though the name is common in several generations of
earlier Le Stranges.
"The History of Parliament also maintains that John Le Strange had married
Jacquetta when he was 6 years of age."
-- Tudorplace Le Strange Genealogy, http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/STRANGE.htm
The date given on the Le Strange Website for the birth of John is 20 May 1444.
Because the Tudorplace Le Strange Genealogy begins the Barony one generation
before the Le Strange Family Website and the Corbet-Le Strange Genealogy, John
(born 1443) is shown there to be 9th Lord Strange of Knockin, whereas I follow
the other two families and show him as 8th Lord Strange of Knockin.
Most sources indicate that the Barony passed from John 7th Lord to his
daughter Joan. Some sources show John as the son of John VIII and Elizabeth
Le Strange. The Tudorplace Le Strange Genealogy indicates that John father of
Joan is the son of Richard, whose parents are John VIII and his second wife,
Maud Mohun.
This source says that Joan, who married George Stanley, was the daughter of
Richard's son John. Because the Tudorplace source is so detailed and careful
in most regards, I am changing the parentage of John father of Joan, to show
his father is Richard the son of John VIII.
U.S. and International Marriage Records, 1560-1900
Jacquetta Wydvile
Gender Female
Spouse Name John
Strange
The Barony of Strange of Hunstanton started as a branch of the original Strange
(Le Strange) family and the Barony of Knockin (Knockyn) in Shropshire, on the
border (frontier or "marches") of Wales.
The Strange family was one of those charged with containing the border area
with the wild Celts of Wales, who would revolt against the Normans
periodically. Hunstanton is in Norfolk, and Strange (Le Strange) lines were
there from the generation or two before the Norman conquest in 1066. The Le
Stranges are associated with the Celtic-Norman counts and Dukes of Brittany.
There is confusion in some genealogies between Maud D'Eiville born 1251, wife
of John IV 1st Lord Strange of Knockin born abt 1253/54, and Isolda de Walton
born 1277, who married his son John VI 2nd Lord Strange of Knockin born 1282.
Some list Maud as Maud de Walton, with the parents of Isolda de Walton: John
de Walton b abt 1231 and Isabel Shirley b abt 1244. They may report Isolda
(Yseult/Maud) de Walton correctly as born 1277, but married to John V born 20
years earlier.
This John, husband of Isolda, was the 6th John in a row, and 2nd Lord Le
Strange of Knockin. His son John was John 7th and 3rd Lord. John VI's son
Roger succeeded his brother as 4th Lord of Knockin.
I have reported Knockin as place of birth, by implication. I note that the
Corbet genealogy reports Ellesmere as place of birth. I have reported Knockin
based on his title as Lord Strange of Knockin. It was the common custom of
nobility for the heir to be born in the estate of the title. This is to
implement the reference in the title "of Knockin." Based on the Corbet report
of Ellesmere as his primary place of residence, I have reported that as the
place of death. The family website does not report any a place of death.
The information in the Le Strange Website is incomplete. They do not state a
specific place of birth for all members. It is possible the Corbett
information is based on more specific information, but that genealogy, as with
so many, did not state its source.